Born Under the Wrong Sign?

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 05 Feb 2005, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Chibi pic pic	05 Feb 2005
Actually, this is more with Zodiac than Tarot...but they're both connected with each other, so it works... Anyway, I was born on Dec 12 (Sagittarius), but I was born two months before my due date (early to mid Feb, making me an Aquarius). I feel like I can identify more with Swords than Wands. Now that I think about it, both my mom and my older sister are Virgos (actually, my mom is borderline, so she could also be a Leo, but she's worse of a wands person than I am!)and if my twin and I were suppose to be Aquarius, that's not very compatible (sword/pentacles). Not surprisingly, my twin doesn't get along with either of them. One of my best friends is a Sag too, and she's very social and outgoing and has a very very bad temper with a very very short fuse; the kind of person that throws things when she gets mad. But I'm nothing like her. Two of my other friends are Aquarius and Libra, and I get along with them very well to the point where I can have real confidence in them with personal matters. All more pointing to Swords-type, right? Interesting...but anyway, do you think it's possible that your "sign" really isn't your sign? Or am I a Wand-type in disguise?

souljourney	06 Feb 2005
Interesting thought. A good friend of mine was born early...I don't remember by how much thought. I will definately direct her to this thread. We even discussed this very idea in relation to just astrology. She was born under the sign of Capricorn and we get along fabulously. I am a Gemini and I do tend to be somewhat like Swords (air), but my ASC is Leo (fire/Wands) and so is my Moon (Sag). I do seem like a combo of both.

Sushi	06 Feb 2005
Have you done your whole chart? You might find that the other houses have a counter effect on the Sag./fire in your chart.

souljourney	06 Feb 2005
www.alabe.com will do the chart for free in like 60 seconds if you need it.

feticeira	06 Feb 2005
Well I`m a cancer drawn to cups yes, but equally to wands. I also happen to know that my moon sign is aries and my ascendant is leo, both fire signs, so it makes perfect sense. In general I´m just really drawn to water and fire and identify with both very much. Needless to say the water/fire personality type is not easy to handle. But anyway, my point is, you simply cannot base everything on your sun sign, there are moon sign and ascendant to be aware of, also the locations of the planets (maybe you have many planets in air signs), the houses and the aspects and angles they all have with each other, that can cause strains in some areas and more ease and cooperation in others. I think what you should look into as suggested by the others is get your chart done, www.astro.com also does it for free and is nice and comprehensive. Also you might want to check in the AT astrology forum, there are many people there who are extremely knowlegdeable and kind to answer questions from those of us interested but not experts by any means.

Chibi pic pic	06 Feb 2005
Okay, I went to www.alabe.com and I got the chart...only problem is, I have no idea whatsoever how to read it. I don't know if posting what I have in words will help, but here we go: Rising Sign is in 15 Degrees Pisces Sun is in 20 Degrees Sagittarius. Moon is in 00 Degrees Capricorn. Mercury is in 00 Degrees Sagittarius. Venus is in 11 Degrees Sagittarius. Mars is in 28 Degrees Libra. Jupiter is in 14 Degrees Aquarius. Saturn is in 03 Degrees Sagittarius. Uranus is in 18 Degrees Sagittarius. Neptune is in 02 Degrees Capricorn. Pluto is in 06 Degrees Scorpio. N. Node is in 08 Degrees Taurus. First off, astronomy wise, does this all mean that on my birthday these particular planets were in these constellations? I guess the bigger question is...what does this all mean?

Phoenix Rising	06 Feb 2005
Hi Chic Refer your chart to the astrology section, and the great astrologers there will be able to help you. There are no mistakes of when you're born, you were destined to be born on that day. Interesting is my daughter is born 12 December too. She is a interesting girl.

firemaiden	06 Feb 2005
...just another illustration of how the tarot is a more flexible system than astrology, and why the two shouldn't be linked (in my veeeeeeeery humble opinion, of course).

Grizabella	06 Feb 2005
In my also veeeery humble opinion, there are no accidents. In my belief system, you were born when you meant to be born, but maybe you were late getting to conception? I don't believe your conception was late, really, but I'm serious in suggesting it would be as unlikely as that you were born under the wrong sign. You were born when it was meant to happen for your Life Path, even though it was early by mortal man's calculations.

Thirteen	06 Feb 2005
I won't go though what all of the houses mean, but I'll cover the big three: Rising, Moon and Sun. This should clarify to you right off why you may think you're Aquarius even though you're not. Chibi pic pic wrote: Rising Sign is in 15 Degrees Pisces This means that even though you are a Sag, you SEEM to be a Pisces--that's how you come across to others. Think of it as the clothing you wear. If people were to guess at your sign, they'd say Pisces. So you appear to be sensitive, shy, artistic, a dreamer. Pisces and Aquarius have a lot in common. The difference is that Aquarians are intellectual and technological, focused on the future of humankind; they can *seem* insensitive or detatched to the plight of individuals. Pisces are artistic and creative, focused on each person, they're highly sensitive to individuals. Quote: Moon is in 00 Degrees Capricorn. This is where you're comfortable; for example, if your Moon was Gemini, then you'd be most comfortable being social and conversational; as Capricorn, your comfort zone is being practical, moving towards a goal. Quiet work with people listening to your orders. Capricorns, like Aquarians, are most comfortable on their own rather than in crowds. The phrase "It's lonely at the top" doesn't apply to Capricorns, that's where they like it--and your comfort zone would seem to be there as well. So what are you *really* like? A Sagittarius (Sun Sign): You thrive on independence (similar to Aquarians) and freedom; like Aquarians, you hate being bored. Like Aquarians, you may be forgetful of important dates and deadlines. UNLIKE Aquarians, however, you're filled with enthuiasm, energy, generosity, optimism, honesty. You search for a universal truth. While Aquarians gaze into humankind's future, Sag's, similarly, have a vision of uniting humankind. And by the by, it's unlikely that it's the Sag. Sun Sign which gives your friend a bad temper. Likely it's some other sign in her chart. Sag's, when they're not galloping on the path of righteousness, are among the most gregarious of signs. The fire of their sign is not in their temper, but in their enthuiasm and energy. They're not going to growl like a Leo or charge like an Aries. They're going to race ahead. So you see, it's not surprising if Aquarius seems very similar to what you are. But I think you'll find both in Pisces rising and your Sag. sun-sign, that you're not detatched enough to be an Aquarius. You're not a cool intellectual--you're most comfortable being Earthy (Cap/earth/pentacles), and you're more interested in exciting activity (Sag/fire/wands), not cooly inventing things in your head--though you may SEEM so to others thanks to your dreamy Pisces (water/cups) Rising. Am I right, or totally off the mark?

Chibi pic pic	06 Feb 2005
Thirteen...you continue to amaze me...most of that was actually very accurate. How you described Pisces, I am very much like that. Creative, a daydreamer...a perfect combination for a writer, no? But I like a little structure, and I like working independently, so that's were the Capricorn comes in. And the Sag tendencies do come out...when I'm not acting like the other two signs. Interesting, very interesting...so this is more of what certain combinations of personalities that make up a whole person rather than one particular sign. Makes sense. After all, you can't categorize a multi-faceted people so narrowly. I just find it interesting about what sign you are as opposed to what sign people think you are, and what sign you feel most comfortable, which could be very different. I may have to look further into this...

Thirteen	06 Feb 2005
Glad to be of help. Rising Signs are often called "masks"--but they're really more than that. They're rather like your surface personality, what you show to the world, yes, but still very much a part of you. When people get to really know you, however, or when they hit your buttons, the real you (that sun sign) comes out with a vengence. My husband is a Virgo, but he's also a Sag. Rising, and when people see him, they're convinced he's a Sag. Full of energy, non-stop activity, he practically glows in the dark. You wouldn't dream he was a Virgo--unless you invite him to your house and something out of order. He'll wander to a shelf of books and start organizing, get out the broom and start sweeping. At his work he's meticuous, a hard-nosed perfectionist. It's as if the carefree, "que-sera, sera" Sag. never was. The Rising-Moon-Sun signs are what account for that transformation we see in people--the one where we say, "Most of the time she's this way ("Y"), but do "X" and suddenly she's a completely different person!" That's probably an instance of getting under the Rising sign on down to the Sun Sign.

AmberWolf	09 Feb 2005
I'm the friend souljourney mentionned, who was born early. I'm born January 7th, at 6 months and a half. So a good 8 weeks early. But I believe, like Lyric said, that there is no "accident". I don't think I am less a Capricorn because I was born early.

firemaiden	09 Feb 2005
Thirteen wrote: My husband is a Virgo, but he's also a Sag. Rising, and when people see him, they're convinced he's a Sag. Full of energy, non-stop activity, he practically glows in the dark. You wouldn't dream he was a Virgo--unless you invite him to your house and something out of order. He'll wander to a shelf of books and start organizing, get out the broom and start sweeping. At his work he's meticuous, a hard-nosed perfectionist. It's as if the carefree, "que-sera, sera" Sag. never was. And this is proof that he's a virgo? Because he's meticulous and organizes? and that's his sun sign coming out with a vengeance? See folks, that's why astrology upsets me. The virgo stereotype = organizing and hard-nosed perfectionist. Who wants to be hit with a label like that? I'm a virgo. You need to come see my house.

DollieAnna	09 Feb 2005
LOL, Firemaiden. I'm a Leo/Leo Aries (Sun/Rising Moon) Our house are probably quite similiar...(kinda like a tornado ran through it?) editing to say: I NEED A MAID!!!!!!

Thirteen	10 Feb 2005
firemaiden wrote: See folks, that's why astrology upsets me. Of course Astrology upsets you. You're a virgo. Virgos are skeptics ;) firemaiden wrote: The virgo stereotype = organizing and hard-nosed perfectionist. Who wants to be hit with a label like that? Let me see if I understand this. Firemaiden, the one who meticulously organized an extensive library of threads for this particular section on reading tarot cards, beautifully arranging all those subjects so...perfectly...is objecting to being called...an organizer? A perfectionist? The protest would work better if you hadn't done such a nice job culling through ALL those threads and arranging them so very well. Quote: I'm a virgo. You need to come see my house. As for your own home...Virgos are as likely to be sloppy as neat in their own homes. I don't mean they're horrible (piles of dirty dishes, roaches, etc.)--but at home, the clothes are piled on the floor, the books are piled in the hall and papers are piled just about everywhere. Virgos are very comfortable, close to sloppy in their own homes because it's theirs--the Hermit cave, if you will. They can let down their hair here and this is why they're so very protective and private about it. You know a Virgo really trusts you if they'll let you into their most private home or special space. But even so, they probably won't let you touch or rearrange anything. They know where everything is and no one gets to move things except them. But bring a Virgo to a different, equally sloppy enviornment, and they'll get the urge to move and tidy so that it's under their control. They may not tidy, but they'll start thinking about how it can all be better organized--ditto with lists and libraries, etc. Who knows better than they how things should be organized and arranged?

BlueLotus	10 Feb 2005
One should also take into account the progression signs, i.e. progressed planets vs natal chart . The last I checked my progression chart at astro.com/extended chart selections/progressed chart , the progressed sun, mercury and venus moved almost two signs , and mars moved one sign ahead ( with different degrees of a sign ) . The progressed moon sign however, receded one sign. So I guess at a certain age, one acts and feels different due to this shift of planets/progressions, which will keep on shifting/progressing gradually as time passes. Manifestation of the traits of a certain sign thereafter should show more clearly when these progressions take full effect. Although I am not any expert on progressions as such, I believe it is probably worth checking it out.

psychic sue	12 Feb 2005
Im not an astrologer, but I have had my chart, and my children's charts done. I always thought that your basic character consisted of your sun sign, your rising sign and your descendant? It's certainly true for me and my children. I remember the question of "early birth" arising on a tv programme once when a celebrity astrologist was conducting a phone in (can't remember who it was). I'm pretty sure that the answer was, your sign derives from when you WERE born not when you SHOULD HAVE been born. Perhaps someone more knowledgable can expand on that for you.

Chibi pic pic	13 Feb 2005
Interesting about the Virgo thing...my mom and older sister are both Virgos and they're on either side of the spectrum. My older sister is one of those untidy people (even the dog doesn't want to go in her room) but for some reason she knows where everything is. My mom's not so extreme, and she wishes she was neater but she really isn't. She's very conscious about cleaning when company comes over though. She also can't help but butt into our affairs, particularly if money's concerned, and she has to be very precise about that. She made us each a spreadsheet of our college expenses and pretty much takes care of the number crunching for us. Might also be that she's an accountant...

rainwolf	14 Feb 2005
Dont ever be sad you are a sagittarius!! I agree with Lyric that you were meant to be born on that day, and maybe you should be happier that you were born earlier because you just HAD to! Remember that sag is the 9th house...the number of perfection...hold you applause:). Yes, sag can have their temper, i know i can have mine, but your planets have a huge affect on you! I have a pisces in mars :( and im not the fighting type. In fact i have a lot of water in my chart, so that brings down my boil to a passive aggressive attack :) Oh, and swords and wands are both masculine suits, so you can be like them no worries. IMHO-im a psychologist minded person, and i believe that astrology has a nature vs nurture affect: I am a saggitarius, but I live with all earth signs (low key home here) and that has made me more grounded. Since i was raised with mostly earth signs (my dad is a sag though), i have learned to be like them, so i keep my fire qualities, while being grounded like my parents. Look at your rising sign too. Update: thirteen wrote: My husband is a Virgo, but he's also a Sag. Rising, and when people see him, they're convinced he's a Sag. Full of energy, non-stop activity, he practically glows in the dark. You wouldn't dream he was a Virgo--unless you invite him to your house and something out of order. He'll wander to a shelf of books and start organizing, get out the broom and start sweeping. At his work he's meticuous, a hard-nosed perfectionist. It's as if the carefree, "que-sera, sera" Sag. never was. My "significant other" is a virgo and i wonder why the hell i leave his house and he doesnt care if his room is completely disarrayed }), yet i come back to find his room is perfect. Just shows that your sun sign comes out to play when the strangers are away. He organizes his DVD's too-i cant stand it!

firemaiden	14 Feb 2005
Thirteen wrote: Let me see if I understand this. Firemaiden, the one who meticulously organized an extensive library of threads for this particular section on reading tarot cards, beautifully arranging all those subjects so...perfectly...is objecting to being called...an organizer? A perfectionist? Do you think everyone who makes an index is automatically a virgo? It's not what I'm about. I'm a creative artist. If I can see anything in common between virgos I know it's not "perfectionism", but artistic sensitivity, and a kind of femininity. Most of the male virgos I know are artists of some kind. But the stereotype used to define this sign is "perfectionism" and organising. I think it is very belittling and insulting to say someone is who they are because of their sign. What about free will? what about choice? what about upbringing and education? How do you know I'm a skeptic automatically because I'm a virgo? I'm a skeptic because I was raised by scientists. Is every daughter of a scientist automatically a virgo?

Fudugazi	14 Feb 2005
firemaiden wrote: Do you think everyone who makes an index is automatically a virgo? It's not what I'm about. I'm a creative artist. If I can see anything in common between virgos I know it's not "perfectionism", but artistic sensitivity, and a kind of femininity. Most of the male virgos I know are artists of some kind. I'll second that. My mother is a Virgo, and she is sensitive and kind, her home and garden are gorgeous, her cooking too - and that even when she had a full-time job! And she also has clean drawers, lots of storage, and labelled boxes for everything ;) I'd call that pretty well-rounded, and as her (rather messy Piscean ^) daughter, I'm grateful for what she taught me.

Thirteen	14 Feb 2005
firemaiden wrote: Is every daughter of a scientist automatically a virgo? I dunno. Every daughter of a scientists who's a skeptic might be a virgo :) Look. You say you're a skeptic because your parents were scientists--but if you'd been born to a family who belived in everything from Crop Circles to the Shroud of Turan, you might still have been the lone skeptic in that family. Skeptics are born into families of "believers" and families of skeptics have "believers." I can't say why you're a skeptic. Maybe your upbringing, maybe your genes, maybe the stars, maybe all of the above or none of the above. I'm certainly not going to try to scientifically prove that your astrological sign is the reason nor would I ever get into an argument that it was the reason. My previous mention of it was made with a smile, and I'm sorry if I failed to make that clear. My husband, by the by, is a creative artist as well, one of the most creative I've ever met. And if someone asked me who/what he was, I'd certainly describe him as an artist, not a perfectionist...though I think he takes no offence in being referred to as a perfectionist; he takes great pride in being neither lazy nor sloppy when it comes to his creations. I meant no insult, Firemaiden. You know as well as I that we can't know each and every person's buttons on this or any other topic. I'm sorry if I pushed a wrong one with you by mentioning a Virgo's neatness rather than their creativity. Mea culpa. I'll try to avoid stepping on toes next time. If, however, it's the mere assignment of personality (any personality be it an "organized" personality or a "creative" personality) by astological sign that offends you, then dancing around those sensitive toes is going to be a lot harder. This is a Forum dedicated to Tarot cards and Astrology is related and often relevant to such discussions.

The Born Under the Wrong Sign? thread was originally posted on 05 Feb 2005 in the Using Tarot Cards board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Using Tarot Cards, or read more archived threads.