Reading AS the mentally ill

Okay, so I popped in 'mentally ill' into the search function, and I saw a lot of threads talking about whether or not it's okay to read for someone who is mentally ill. Generally there's a big disagreement over whether bipolar people are 'safe enough' to read for (usually with an amendment that they aren't -that- bad, not like those -schizophrenics-). To be honest the entire experience was a bit upsetting, but I'm going to try to keep a cool head through this. The point is, there are a lot of threads about how ethical it is to read for someone who is mentally ill, but I saw none about whether or not it's ethical to read when -you- are the one who is mentally ill.

This is not that thread, by the way.

Instead I'm going to ask -how- you read when you're the one who is mentally ill. I'm going to be assuming that if you're here, and you're mentally ill, then you've already figured out that ethical dilemma by yourself.

How do you cope with stigma? How do you deal with side effects of medication that can harm your intuition and creativity? If you are prone to delusions, how do you deal with that in regards to tarot? Does anxiety make you constantly doubt yourself and your readings? Are bad tarot readings at times a 'trigger' for your mood swings if you have them? How do you stay calm?

I really hope this thread doesn't turn into another debate about whether mentally ill people are 'safe' around tarot. I think my opinion on the manner is obvious.

I'm going to wait for a reply before I reveal some of my calming tips. Hopefully that's okay.

Also, if anyone tries to say that people with x mental illness are better at tarot because they are so ~in touch~ with other worlds or whatever, or because of their ~suffering~...be prepared for my extremely vocal opinion on exactly how offensive and ableist that kind of stuff is, and how damaging such views can be. I'd -like- this thread to be a safe space for people with various mental stuff to talk about how they read, but I don't have any authority to mod this thread or make that happen. So I'll just threaten people with the dreaded side-eye if derailment happens.

If you do end up posting and you read all of the above, I appreciate it.

I think it depends on one's general attitude towards it, although that's kind of a non-statement since it applies to anything. I've had a history of depression, but somehow it never got to Tarot. During my worst times I didn't use it at all, self-reflection and improvement were the furthest things from my mind at the time. Luckily, I also managed to somehow avoid the traps of obsessive readings, or the feeling that if the cards say something it is an irreversible sentence. I did quite a lot of stupid things in my time that were fueled by feelings of depression and inadequacy, but thankfully Tarot stayed relatively clean of all that. Somehow.

Still, that's just my experiences, others' will be different. The allure of a handy oracle that tells the future can be quite strong, especially for people who are prone to strong beliefs. My own depression, though, came in the form of disbelief or connection to things, so I never really committed to Tarot to the extent that it would be harmful. On the other hand, this also gave me the ability to try out many things while not becoming addicted to any, like a course in Scientology (utter crap) or some strange Hindu/hippy/assorted anything/Hare Krishna movement sect where I was invited to live in a commune (although that was easy, those people looked as if they didn't bathe). I was also invited to join a Ceremonial magick circle, and in time do something or other with GD grades, but I lacked the discipline to go through with it (possibly a symptom of some internalized depression in itself, who knows).

I think it depends on a) whether you KNOW you are mentally ill - quite often a part of the illness is not knowing there is anything wrong - even with people who go up and down with it, and b) if you do - whether you feel competent.

I feel no stigma at all about this, by the way - I have been hospitalised at one point, and have History ! But I am not in the least ashamed - it isn't a sin, any more than measles. I make a point of mentioning it when it is relevant, as that is the ONLY way the stigma that others feel will ever dissipate.

When I go under, I can still tell whether I am capable of reading. Others may not be so lucky, but what I learned in hospital made this kind of thing possible. I don't feel it brings me closer to anything in particular. I doubt myself when reading, even when I am 100% OK. Don't we all ? (well, no, actually, I know some people here don't and that amazes me.)

Basically - I read on days when I am fine to read. If I feel I am not up to it - flu, hangover, antibiotics, stomach ache - or mental illness - I don't read. I don't warn anyone about any of it. Why should I ?

Oh and I couldn't agree more about the able-ist stuff. I am - as a deaf person - sometimes described as "differently abled" to be sure I don't feel stigmatised which makes NO sense to me, as I NEED people to know when I don't hear them and I am still reeling from the blind couple who hoped their child was born blind so that it could share fully in their world... )

What is normal...?

Many have suggested that simply reading the cards at all is leaning away from the norm...Whatever that is...


It's also interesting that you propose threats and reprisals to any that don't do as you want them to....Now that I find interesting indeed...

Good point there - as I don't read for myself even when at my very best, the obsessive side of it has never occurred to me. But if I did - I have an addictive/obsessive personality - so I'd probably fall into that !

Still - no-one I have read for when in the pit has ever questioned what they got from me in any way differently from the way people do at any other time.

I have had bipolar since my late teens and my medication has not left me unable to do readings or debilitated on how i see certain interpretations in my readings, i also have a family member who has suffered with schizophrenia who i think has more of difficult time then how i feel on most days, but then i can see how they might be able to interpret different answers more with their inner thoughts of hearing or seeing things around them?

I personally don't think anyone suffering from depression are more at disadvantaged giving readings then lets say someone who was not mentally ill, i think depression makes you realize that you are able to cope with certain difficulties in life which can help support others in need.

re-pete-a said:

What is normal...?

Many have suggested that simply reading the cards at all is leaning away from the norm...Whatever that is...


It's also interesting that you propose threats and reprisals to any that don't do as you want them to....Now that I find interesting indeed...

Click to expand...

Well, I know normal -isn't- thinking you're in a coma and that the band Queen is contacting you from the dead with their music and that their lyrics hold the key to you waking up.

True story. Fun times.

Now to be fair, doing this: '>>' is hardly a threat at all. It's more of a joke, though one that may just be popular among my own friend circle. Apologies if I wasn't clear, I've been having extreme insomnia lately, so I'm not 100%.

As for me giving my opinion on things that are harmful to people like me...yeah, you're right, I see nothing wrong with that. Though it's less 'not doing what I want them to do' and more 'coming into yet another thread about mental illness and tarot and being disrespectful/beating a dead horse/ect...'

I think you're reading a bit far into my anger at people ostracizing me just because I got the short end of the genetic/environment stick. Yes, I'm angry. I think I have a right to be angry at this point. Not at singular people, but in general. I'm sorry that it seeps into what I type, but quite frankly I'm tired of being compliant in a society that treats me like I should be locked up, no matter what or how much medication I'm on. :/

gregory said:

I think it depends on a) whether you KNOW you are mentally ill - quite often a part of the illness is not knowing there is anything wrong - even with people who go up and down with it, and b) if you do - whether you feel competent.

I feel no stigma at all about this, by the way - I have been hospitalised at one point, and have History ! But I am not in the least ashamed - it isn't a sin, any more than measles. I make a point of mentioning it when it is relevant, as that is the ONLY way the stigma that others feel will ever dissipate.

When I go under, I can still tell whether I am capable of reading. Others may not be so lucky, but what I learned in hospital made this kind of thing possible. I don't feel it brings me closer to anything in particular. I doubt myself when reading, even when I am 100% OK. Don't we all ? (well, no, actually, I know some people here don't and that amazes me.)

Basically - I read on days when I am fine to read. If I feel I am not up to it - flu, hangover, antibiotics, stomach ache - or mental illness - I don't read. I don't warn anyone about any of it. Why should I ?

Oh and I couldn't agree more about the able-ist stuff. I am - as a deaf person - sometimes described as "differently abled" to be sure I don't feel stigmatised which makes NO sense to me, as I NEED people to know when I don't hear them and I am still reeling from the blind couple who hoped their child was born blind so that it could share fully in their world... )

Click to expand...

I agree with pretty much all of this. I'm pretty open about my mental illness myself, for the explicit reason of fighting stigma. Most people in real life don't believe that I'm -that- mentally ill when it comes up.

I'm schizoaffective depressive subtype, which basically means I have schizophrenia with major depression on top of it. Fun stuff. I have to deal with serious psychosis (no, I don't get violent) if I don't take my medication, but even when I -am- psychotic, there are certain things I won't do.

Like read tarot for myself or someone else while I'm psychotic. I don't generally have religious/spiritual delusions, but I'm still very careful to keep myself out of situations where I might develop them.

I probably shouldn't have written the intro to this thread as I did, but it was rough reading the other threads and seeing exactly how many people thought that people like me shouldn't be let around a tarot deck, and/or how 'well, they just have bipolar, it'd be different if it was psychosis'. The way that people with disabilities or mental illnesses will throw each other under the bus astounds and saddens me.

Heh, can anyone tell I'm bitter yet?

I'll work on a nice post full of more content in a short bit, right now I need to eat breakfast.

Enjoy your breakfast. I TOTALLY agree with all you have said. People can be so bloody dismissive the second you say you've been in the bin. I have never forgotten the day when someone I love dearly, who said - when I was over the biggest episode I have had, and when I had genuinely seen something REALLY bad happening - not using cards or anything - just observed it IRL - "oh well, that's you, it's just your illness talking - it's all in your head." Which it wasn't and MAN did that ever come out later in spades. I enjoyed that bit BIG time.

"Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get me" is a great maxim, I find.

And we need to stand up for ourselves, even if it means others feel threatened. We are threatened daily. Feed them their own medicine; you just have to sometimes.,

I agree with this. I think everyone has better and worse moments/days/years due to mental and emotional stress and coping ability in whatever their circumstances are, and that it doesn't make sense to me to pretend that there is anyone who never has times of duress where their coping skills are not what they might want them to be given their circumstances. I personally feel that everyone has been impacted by trauma to some degree simply by being alive, and that life involves figuring out what you feel and think and are and have and what you can do to make the best of it, with or without perfect health, millions of dollars, privilege, whatever. That's why I do readings about 'best outcome' of a situation, since to me that seems most useful to people, whatever their starting point.

If I am overwhelmed by life or health or stress and emotional exhaustion, there are times I simply do not do readings: I am lucky enough to be able to set my own schedule in that regard since I mostly do them online or once amonth or so in person in NYC. For example, yesterday I gave some readings here which went along fine, and at a certain point somone got upset and took my mistake of not seeing of his/her request personally, and within a minute or so someone else asked some stuff out of left field about could I help stalk someone, so I tidied things up and knew my time on that thread was over, except if the upset person still wanted a reading after understanding I had not been mean but had simply missed the request. *shrug* Once or twice a season I also stay home from that night's rehearsal, since I am a pretty fair barometer of how overwhelmed others in that situation are likely to be too, and every time it turns out that it was the right thing to do: that people simply yelled and sobbed all night at the rehearsal, or no one showed up due to circumstances etc., and I would not have been able to help anyhow. I think it's just wisdom to avoid glaringly stressful situations if there is no benefit in it to self or others. If I can help others stay calm in an ugly time, that's fine. If I am not going to benefit them and/or further develop my skills in helping others, it seems unproductive to persist or try to force anything. YMMV

EDIT TO ADD: Actually, I am a psychotherapist who works primarily these days with folks with old-fashioned multiple personalities--I don't call it a 'disorder' but just think of it as a brilliant internal filing system that has helped them survive--and that, with the buddhism specialty, has given me a lot of exposure to situations beyond what people think is 'normal'. I think that folks are much more affected by things like others' energy, world events, weather, trauma, pollution and electrical pollution etc., than most people understand, so to me all sorts of stuff makes sense from its own view: if I perceive things as me being in a coma or nonawake/depersonalised state and find songs to have messages for me, as someone mentions running into above, that may only differ from another person and the music-plus-cards readings people do here by level of ability to cope with the daily life, if even that--it could be perceived as a form of intuition, spiritual emergency, world view, personal spiritual journey, whatever. I think there are zillions of ways to be, and things change as the organism/person/being tries to cope with life and be happy, sometimes without too much success. It can be hard for all of us at times.

And yes, one of my dear friends who is multiple gets readings from me in person and finds them really helpful and interesting--

gregory said:

I think it depends on a) whether you KNOW you are mentally ill - quite often a part of the illness is not knowing there is anything wrong - even with people who go up and down with it, and b) if you do - whether you feel competent.

I feel no stigma at all about this, by the way - I have been hospitalised at one point, and have History ! But I am not in the least ashamed - it isn't a sin, any more than measles. I make a point of mentioning it when it is relevant, as that is the ONLY way the stigma that others feel will ever dissipate.

When I go under, I can still tell whether I am capable of reading. Others may not be so lucky, but what I learned in hospital made this kind of thing possible. I don't feel it brings me closer to anything in particular. I doubt myself when reading, even when I am 100% OK. Don't we all ? (well, no, actually, I know some people here don't and that amazes me.)

Basically - I read on days when I am fine to read. If I feel I am not up to it - flu, hangover, antibiotics, stomach ache - or mental illness - I don't read. I don't warn anyone about any of it. Why should I ?

Oh and I couldn't agree more about the able-ist stuff. I am - as a deaf person - sometimes described as "differently abled" to be sure I don't feel stigmatised which makes NO sense to me, as I NEED people to know when I don't hear them and I am still reeling from the blind couple who hoped their child was born blind so that it could share fully in their world... )

Click to expand...