Two confusing conversations today regarding the Thoth

Thought I'd come and ask the experts.

I was hanging out/helping out in my favourite shop today. The first encounter was with a lovely chap who was looking at the large size and thought that the edition his friend had some years ago was bigger and made of thicker cards than the samples.

The second encounter was with a woman who wanted to see all the cards in the Thoth deck (rather than just the samples) before she bought it. I had my new US Games three magus edition with me so I offered to let her look at mine. She went through the cards (rather violently, I might add, they are still in shock!) and said that some of them were wrong, that the designs had been changed, not just the colours but the pictures, specifically the five of swords.

So, my questions are:

1) was there ever a deck larger (or maybe just on thicker card) than the large blue box edition?

and

2) had she lost the plot or have I?

(just curious)

avalonian said:

2) had she lost the plot or have I?

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There's nothing wrong with your deck. You've just had a close encounter with a nutcase.

Was it a New age shop you were in? Those places are like looney magnets.

Aeon418 said:

There's nothing wrong with your deck. You've just had a close encounter with a nutcase.

Was it a New age shop you were in? Those places are like looney magnets.

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Well, it is in Glastonbury, so I'm used to strange encounters, but I've been going there nearly every week for about ten years and I've never come home quite as bemused as this before. It wasn't just what she said that threw me, but the lack of respect that she showed the deck. The chap who owns the shop asked me if the deck was bruised, we could almost hear it whimpering! I've been shuffling it gently since I got home to try and reassure it a bit!

(((virtual hug)))

Sounds like she may have had a nodding acquaintance with RWS and doesn't know there is a difference?

avalonian said:

1) was there ever a deck larger (or maybe just on thicker card) than the large blue box edition?

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I don't think so - I'm fairly sure that that's the one "large" size (and I wish they'd do a bigger one! ) but it's possible that there were different cardstocks down through the various stages of printing. But I've had a fair few Thoths through my hands and the cardstock has been comparable on all of them.

2) had she lost the plot or have I?

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Nope, AFAIK the images have stayed the same since their first publication. The colours have been tinkered with digitally, the originals rephotographed and so on, but the images are the same. She's the one who's a bit unhinged.

The chap who owns the shop asked me if the deck was bruised, we could almost hear it whimpering! I've been shuffling it gently since I got home to try and reassure it a bit!

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I don't think you need to worry this is one tough damn deck. It's the one that beats up all your other decks late at night after you've gone to sleep . . . they cringe from it It can take care of itself.

\m/ Kat

AJ said:

(((virtual hug)))

Sounds like she may have had a nodding acquaintance with RWS and doesn't know there is a difference?

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I wondered whether she had seen some cards reversed, as she had definitely seen the Thoth before. It was odd because she said "some" of the cards were different, not all of them. I would have asked what the differences were but I could see that conversation turning into an argument so I just let it go.

thorhammer said:

I don't think so - I'm fairly sure that that's the one "large" size (and I wish they'd do a bigger one! ) but it's possible that there were different cardstocks down through the various stages of printing. But I've had a fair few Thoths through my hands and the cardstock has been comparable on all of them.Nope, AFAIK the images have stayed the same since their first publication. The colours have been tinkered with digitally, the originals rephotographed and so on, but the images are the same. She's the one who's a bit unhinged. I don't think you need to worry this is one tough damn deck. It's the one that beats up all your other decks late at night after you've gone to sleep . . . they cringe from it It can take care of itself.

\m/ Kat

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That confirms what I thought, so thanks for that. It was one of those situations where someone says something that you know is incorrect, but they say it with such certainty that you start to doubt yourself.

The Sixties Remembered?

The version of the Thoth deck available in the sixties was a lower quality printing with inferior coloring.

I wouldn't say exactly LOWER; they are rather fine. But I wonder - if she wanted to see all the cards - was it that she expected WS symbolism and ordering and was shocked at Justice and Strength being "reversed" and stuff like that ?

And at least one early printing had actual mistakes - Ace Disks was printed upside down, and 8 disks had the 8 missing....

gregory said:

I wouldn't say exactly LOWER; they are rather fine. But I wonder - if she wanted to see all the cards - was it that she expected WS symbolism and ordering and was shocked at Justice and Strength being "reversed" and stuff like that ?

And at least one early printing had actual mistakes - Ace Disks was printed upside down, and 8 disks had the 8 missing....

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I don't think she expected WS symbolism as she said that some of the cards were wrong, not all of them, and when I asked her for an example the one she picked out was the five of swords. She had seen some of the card samples (they have a few in a looseleaf file) but seemed a bit put-out that she couldn't see all the cards which was why I offered to show her mine. It was as if she was saying that my deck was printed wrong, like it was a counterfeit copy or something.

What confused me, was that if she thought she had such good knowledge of the cards, why did she need to see all of them? I wish it had been the Ace of Discs, at least that would now make sense (that's fascinating, about the printing mistakes by the way, I learn something every day by coming here).