Fulgour
Pamela Colman Smith lived comfortably in Bude, Cornwall.wandking said:
Her burial site has remained undisclosed, but it's no secret.
a question regarding pamela colman smith's interpetation of the tarot.
Her burial site has remained undisclosed, but it's no secret.
Moongold
Which story?
Kaplan and other accounts say differently. In fact, her relatively poor circumstances at the time of her death have been emphasized against the contribution she made.
What authenticity lies behind either claim - Kaplan's and yours, that is? I think it is quite interesting and important.
Fulgour ~Fulgour said:Pamela Colman Smith lived comfortably in Bude, Cornwall.
Her burial site has remained undisclosed, but it's no secret.
Kaplan and other accounts say differently. In fact, her relatively poor circumstances at the time of her death have been emphasized against the contribution she made.
What authenticity lies behind either claim - Kaplan's and yours, that is? I think it is quite interesting and important.
BemboBimbo
Sola Busca Deck
I'm new to the list so I'm curious as to whether anyone else uses the Sola Busca ("Ancient Warriors") deck, or have read the book on it by Sofia Di Vincenzo and Giordano Berti, published by US Games, 1998 (the only one I could find)? I found it through an inquiry to U.S. Games, who did not advertise it but had a few left in their warehouse. I don't know why it was not more popular, as I find it very helpful, especially regarding the alchemical connections of the Tarot. Di Vincenzo is an Italian scholar on alchemy, and Berti edited a catalogue on an exhibition "Le carte di corte. Gioco e magia alla corte degli Estensi", in Bologna in 1987.
I highly recommend Pisces Dreamer look into the SB deck. Although Pamela CS was inspired by the these first (or only) Renaissance pip cards pictures to have survived (and created not too long after the Visconti-Sforza decks), and I highly value her/Waite's deck, I find that most of the pictures, atmospheres, and symbolism are very different from the SB. I realize that just as Pamela used her intuition, so did the modern authors/interpreters of the book I've cited - and I must add that I don't always see or agree with their interpretations (the history of Tarot/alchemy is more their strength). But I do see a great leap from most of the pictures' concepts to Pamela CS's. Which is of course, legitimate poetic license, but I hear many people say either that they are directly derived from them, or don't know about the SB at all.
Just looking for feedback, I guess! Thanks.
I'm new to the list so I'm curious as to whether anyone else uses the Sola Busca ("Ancient Warriors") deck, or have read the book on it by Sofia Di Vincenzo and Giordano Berti, published by US Games, 1998 (the only one I could find)? I found it through an inquiry to U.S. Games, who did not advertise it but had a few left in their warehouse. I don't know why it was not more popular, as I find it very helpful, especially regarding the alchemical connections of the Tarot. Di Vincenzo is an Italian scholar on alchemy, and Berti edited a catalogue on an exhibition "Le carte di corte. Gioco e magia alla corte degli Estensi", in Bologna in 1987.
I highly recommend Pisces Dreamer look into the SB deck. Although Pamela CS was inspired by the these first (or only) Renaissance pip cards pictures to have survived (and created not too long after the Visconti-Sforza decks), and I highly value her/Waite's deck, I find that most of the pictures, atmospheres, and symbolism are very different from the SB. I realize that just as Pamela used her intuition, so did the modern authors/interpreters of the book I've cited - and I must add that I don't always see or agree with their interpretations (the history of Tarot/alchemy is more their strength). But I do see a great leap from most of the pictures' concepts to Pamela CS's. Which is of course, legitimate poetic license, but I hear many people say either that they are directly derived from them, or don't know about the SB at all.
Just looking for feedback, I guess! Thanks.
le pendu
BemboBimbo,
Welcome to Aeclectic, you're already adding to the vast knowledge here, thank you! I haven't heard of this book by Sofia Di Vincenzo and Giordano Berti, but Berti seems well respected by many folks here whose opinons I admire.
best,
robert
Welcome to Aeclectic, you're already adding to the vast knowledge here, thank you! I haven't heard of this book by Sofia Di Vincenzo and Giordano Berti, but Berti seems well respected by many folks here whose opinons I admire.
best,
robert
tmgrl2
Hi piscesdreamer....
My understanding of the state of PCS's financial affairs at the time of her death comes from Kaplan (Encyclopedia of Tarot III).
The opening chapter in Kaplan is a bio of PCS. It's a lovely chapter filled with many of her pre-Tarot images.
I, too, was amazed when I first saw the Sola Busca...and the similarities in it to PCS's deck.
At the end of her life, according to Kaplan, she left her entire estate to her friend, Nora Lake. Supposedly, she had some monies from an American trust fun, but the executors of her estate found that these funds were not enough for her to live on.
Susequently, she had many debts, which included unpaid income tax.....after estate was "handled," her creditors accepted about 25% in satisfaction of her debts...so there was nothing left for her friend, Nora, who lived with her in Bencoolen House, in Bude.
I find the RWS deck magical to read with...even though I also use the Tarot de Marseille decks. I have about 5 decks I use to do readings.n I mostly use the Radiant RW, because I gifted my Universal RWS to a friend and the other one I own is in a photo album for me to "look at" when we discuss cards.
As others here are saying...one cannot use a narrow interpretation of any card in Tarot....and, as jmd, said, sometimes, it's a single element that pops forward during a reading.
Even with spreads, when people are trying to learn them, many seem to want a single "definition" for a particular position in a spread....and reading just doesn't work like that...one has to look at all of the cards, the presence or absence of Trumps and/ or minor arcana.where the cards falls, what topic comes forward, and then, through meditation, see what the individual cards bring to the overall narative that hopefully evolves....which we call "The Reading."
I don't regret, though, one bit of the reading of books and posts here at AT and the studying of individual cards from various decks.
When I DO a reading, though, I'm never quite sure what will come out of my mouth, until we have settled in, shuffled, talked a bit and then...
I draw the cards....or sometimes my sitter does...I don't pre-plan my spreads, decks ( I give a couple of choices, no more than three) ....
It's really quite a marvelous event....
terri
So I would say...go ahead and study various sources, read here at AT as much as you can in all areas....
But...
Also....read for "live" querents.
That's when you sense whether or not you are in the right place doing what you love to do....and maybe helping another person along with something in their life.
Even when I did my first "live" reading, I engaged the sitter in giving some input on some of the cards. I was in charge of the process, but at times, I just feel the need to ask the querent...What do you think of or see when you look at this card?
terri
My understanding of the state of PCS's financial affairs at the time of her death comes from Kaplan (Encyclopedia of Tarot III).
The opening chapter in Kaplan is a bio of PCS. It's a lovely chapter filled with many of her pre-Tarot images.
I, too, was amazed when I first saw the Sola Busca...and the similarities in it to PCS's deck.
At the end of her life, according to Kaplan, she left her entire estate to her friend, Nora Lake. Supposedly, she had some monies from an American trust fun, but the executors of her estate found that these funds were not enough for her to live on.
Susequently, she had many debts, which included unpaid income tax.....after estate was "handled," her creditors accepted about 25% in satisfaction of her debts...so there was nothing left for her friend, Nora, who lived with her in Bencoolen House, in Bude.
I find the RWS deck magical to read with...even though I also use the Tarot de Marseille decks. I have about 5 decks I use to do readings.n I mostly use the Radiant RW, because I gifted my Universal RWS to a friend and the other one I own is in a photo album for me to "look at" when we discuss cards.
As others here are saying...one cannot use a narrow interpretation of any card in Tarot....and, as jmd, said, sometimes, it's a single element that pops forward during a reading.
Even with spreads, when people are trying to learn them, many seem to want a single "definition" for a particular position in a spread....and reading just doesn't work like that...one has to look at all of the cards, the presence or absence of Trumps and/ or minor arcana.where the cards falls, what topic comes forward, and then, through meditation, see what the individual cards bring to the overall narative that hopefully evolves....which we call "The Reading."
I don't regret, though, one bit of the reading of books and posts here at AT and the studying of individual cards from various decks.
When I DO a reading, though, I'm never quite sure what will come out of my mouth, until we have settled in, shuffled, talked a bit and then...
I draw the cards....or sometimes my sitter does...I don't pre-plan my spreads, decks ( I give a couple of choices, no more than three) ....
It's really quite a marvelous event....
terri
So I would say...go ahead and study various sources, read here at AT as much as you can in all areas....
But...
Also....read for "live" querents.
That's when you sense whether or not you are in the right place doing what you love to do....and maybe helping another person along with something in their life.
Even when I did my first "live" reading, I engaged the sitter in giving some input on some of the cards. I was in charge of the process, but at times, I just feel the need to ask the querent...What do you think of or see when you look at this card?
terri
Cerulean
On the Sola Busca with book/PCS art style
1. This thread discusses speculation of Sola Busca as a prototype:
http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=32069&highlight=sola+busca
2. This has a bit more about the book:
http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=27394&highlight=sola+busca
In the second thread, there's a link to a review of the Sola Busca and Michael Hurst's commentary of the original Sola Busca black and white plates (I believe).
When we look at Berti's writing in the book, his introduction is describing card editions of Ferrarese engraving. Maybe I read too much into him distancing himself from the writers of the Sola Busca book playful ideas of the game; noting the plates are colored, later titled by an unknown hand; and the idea the illustrations might be 19th century reproductions.
The partial excerpts I've read of the Boiardo poem is not as a player of such card games, so I'm probably less inclined to see the similarities of the Sola Busca structure with the characters in the M.M. Boiardo poem!
However if you are hungry for details in the Ferarra era, of course I say it is an interesting edition to a research library. But of course I'd save my other Ferarra texts first...(just an opinion).
--------------------------------------------------------------
I tend to see Pamela Colman Smiths line-work more with the Japanesque graphics of the 1890's and early 1900s...someone was kind enough to show me a copy of an instruction book from one of her Pratt Institute teachers, Arthur Wesley Dow. From what I've seen, I saw PCS linework that felt more in common with illustrators such as Edmund Dulac, a friend of Yeats, and even Aubrey Beardsley. For a very short time, I had hand-tinted prints from the PCS' Green Sheaf, but it's been allocated to another museum-oriented collection now...
...and that linework style works for me on many different levels, possibly more so after I look at Waite's descriptions because there is something both of him and of her there. Did you know A. Beardsley would draw small birdlike symbols to indicate the outdoors to people? A kind of tiny shorthand detail that I like in PCS' work in many skyscapes that also include rolling clouds...
Best wishes!
Cerulean
1. This thread discusses speculation of Sola Busca as a prototype:
http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=32069&highlight=sola+busca
2. This has a bit more about the book:
http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=27394&highlight=sola+busca
In the second thread, there's a link to a review of the Sola Busca and Michael Hurst's commentary of the original Sola Busca black and white plates (I believe).
When we look at Berti's writing in the book, his introduction is describing card editions of Ferrarese engraving. Maybe I read too much into him distancing himself from the writers of the Sola Busca book playful ideas of the game; noting the plates are colored, later titled by an unknown hand; and the idea the illustrations might be 19th century reproductions.
The partial excerpts I've read of the Boiardo poem is not as a player of such card games, so I'm probably less inclined to see the similarities of the Sola Busca structure with the characters in the M.M. Boiardo poem!
However if you are hungry for details in the Ferarra era, of course I say it is an interesting edition to a research library. But of course I'd save my other Ferarra texts first...(just an opinion).
--------------------------------------------------------------
I tend to see Pamela Colman Smiths line-work more with the Japanesque graphics of the 1890's and early 1900s...someone was kind enough to show me a copy of an instruction book from one of her Pratt Institute teachers, Arthur Wesley Dow. From what I've seen, I saw PCS linework that felt more in common with illustrators such as Edmund Dulac, a friend of Yeats, and even Aubrey Beardsley. For a very short time, I had hand-tinted prints from the PCS' Green Sheaf, but it's been allocated to another museum-oriented collection now...
...and that linework style works for me on many different levels, possibly more so after I look at Waite's descriptions because there is something both of him and of her there. Did you know A. Beardsley would draw small birdlike symbols to indicate the outdoors to people? A kind of tiny shorthand detail that I like in PCS' work in many skyscapes that also include rolling clouds...
Best wishes!
Cerulean
Fulgour
St. Peter's Catholic Church in Bude Cornwall has a cemetery.Moongold said:
How many parishioners buried there do you suppose are lost.
As for money, and such a thing as debts and taxes, tut, tut.
Let's celebrate the life of this artist, and honour her memory.
Moongold
Fulgour said:
Have always honoured her memory!
She was great
.Fulgour
Absolutely! And while any text book historians can lambasteMoongold said:Have always honoured her memory! She was great
my feeble revisionism, I've read enough history not to worry.
Rosanne
Am I Blind?
Well I fell into this thread, and it answered a lot of things I have been mulling over and made a lot of my questions redundant. I wish I knew how to print this thread out. Thank you Pisces Dreamer for opening this discussion up. Now all I have to do for myself is go search for someones Great Great Grandmother or Father who squirreled away their Tarot Journal and left it in some Museums Archives(another thread opened by me without researching prior threads) I know there will be that find, as I go grinning and dancing up to our well endowed wee Museum. A Le Mat journey that might even end up at the Smithsonian or maybe in our own Alexander Turnbull Library- who knows?
Well I fell into this thread, and it answered a lot of things I have been mulling over and made a lot of my questions redundant. I wish I knew how to print this thread out. Thank you Pisces Dreamer for opening this discussion up. Now all I have to do for myself is go search for someones Great Great Grandmother or Father who squirreled away their Tarot Journal and left it in some Museums Archives(another thread opened by me without researching prior threads) I know there will be that find, as I go grinning and dancing up to our well endowed wee Museum. A Le Mat journey that might even end up at the Smithsonian or maybe in our own Alexander Turnbull Library- who knows?
