card for shame or embarassment

[JennyM]

5 of cups?

 

[coeur]

I tend to think of it as the 5 of Swords since Swords have more to do with 'honor' and 'pride' than Cups do in my mind.

 

[Papageno]

exactly what I was about to post. 5/swords

 

[JennyM]

exactly what I was about to post. 5/swords

The most prominent figure on the 5 of swords (Rider Waite) doesn't feel any shame. The reason I said 5 of cups was the figure's posture on the Rider-Waite card. Yes, there's regret there and sadness of a look-what-happened variety, but might there not also be a bit of shame as well? You know, hanging his head in shame.

 

[celticnoodle]

I can see the 5cups as shame and embarassment, and even the 5 pents. not so much the 5 swords, unless you are one of the people walking away from the 'fight'. also I can see it in the 6swords and maybe even the 8cups, 9swords, and with my Golden TArot deck, the Emperor seems to depict shame and embarrasment too.

 

[coeur]

The most prominent figure on the 5 of swords (Rider Waite) doesn't feel any shame. The reason I said 5 of cups was the figure's posture on the Rider-Waite card. Yes, there's regret there and sadness of a look-what-happened variety, but might there not also be a bit of shame as well? You know, hanging his head in shame.

I chose the 5 of Swords for elemental and numerological reasons, though everyone is entitled to personal intuitive interpretations. I am really fascinated by the numerology that exists in Tarot and I find it holds some interesting insights for me. In addition, I use the Thoth deck so it is much more difficult to gain insight from the pictures because the pictures don't feature human figures. For that reason, I have come to rely heavily on the symbolic origins of the numbers.

5 is considered the test that brings us from "substance but no physical existence" to "substance that also has physical existence"--call it that traumatizing experience of being born that Dali keeps talking about, I guess. There is also a marked separation from the original spark of the Ace, and it shows how physicality results in loss. Everything with a physical existence is subject to the corrosion of time, so 5s are especially mindful of how things are lost due to the passage of time.

5 of Cups is being separated from the primal virtues of Cups--emotions, dreams, optimism, love, trust, and family--it shows how time corrodes these virtues. It is true embarrassment or shame can come from the loss of dreams, love, and trust over time, but the word 'embarrassment' itself suggests someone has done something in order to 'embarrass' him or herself. Because embarrassment and shame are almost always used in social contexts and what embarrasses a person is different from culture to culture and is especially dependent on the social constructs of that culture, I am more inclined to believe embarrassment falls into the realm of Swords. In short, most people are embarrassed about something because they have done something that is not socially acceptable.

For me, Swords has always been human civilization and interaction. Two people might have differing emotions, but in the end, it is through utilizing Sword energy that they engage in conflict with one another--especially a quarrel. I tend to look back at the Tower of Babel story when it comes to Swords (though I am not religious; I hope I do not offend), since Swords are especially interested in communication and language--human constructs.

The Tower of Babel was constructed with humans believing their intelligence, knowledge, and language could overcome obstacles like time and nature. As we all know, the Tower of Babel was then placed against nature (God in this case) and it was destroyed resulting in the loss of human pride. Swords can mean creative human interactions like talking, communicating, fairness, honesty, etc--but as humans interact, pride appears as well as society, social norms, social ideals, and a strong conviction that human power can overcome divine power (whatever that is).

Looking at the Raider-Waite deck, I tend to see the main character viewing others as they retreat and disperse. The others are running away from the battle, but there is no enemy to be seen. For me, the lack of a physical enemy suggests the enemy is actually time. Over time, human language, knowledge, society, and civilization will all come into ruin. Empires do not last forever. Human interaction that is not combined with love and trust results in disharmony and dishonor in the end.

Sorry for the long ramble, but I thought I would just jot down some thoughts and share. Reading the Book of Thoth has really made me investigate why Swords are so negative and hurtful, and I think the main argument is Swords are a function of pride and humans are more or less known for their extravagant sense of pride.

 

[tabi]

In RWS tradition.

5 of Pentacles as abused pride and ego.

5 of Cups as lost and sorrow.

5 of Wands as pettiness and shallowness

5 of Swords as greed and intentional cruelty.

This is my own thoughts, I think a lot of this is how we ourselves look at a particular card and situation combined together with our own personal experiences. For shame and embarassment I would see that as the 9 of Swords in the traditional RWS.

 

[GoddessArtemis]

5 of Cups - regret over spilled cups
5 of Pentacles - shame/embarrassment of self or situation

GA

 

[greycats]

What about the three of swords?

Actually the three of swords works pretty well if your interpretations can ride along a sliding scale. For me, the card's meaning can vary from a near-suicidal emotional melt-down to the sort of heart scalding that results from petty slights and catty remarks. I would think embarrassment and shame are feelings that are not too far removed from these.

 

[balenciaga]

7 wands rx

Okay, do not throw anything at me, but the LWB says that the 7 of Wands RX can mean "embarrassment".