The Power of Myth

[Richard]

I should clarify that what I'm actually asking is something like: What is it about, say, the myth of gypsies bringing tarot from ancient Egypt that appeals to people so much that they prefer it to truth?
.....

It's delightful to have a forum in which free discussion of peripheral issues is not discouraged, and I'm greatly enjoying the discussion of the history of Kabbalah and its possible connection to Tarot. However, I'm also interested in the original topic: What is going on in the minds and hearts of people who prefer fantasy to fact regarding Tarot origins?

 

[Teheuti]

However, I'm also interested in the original topic: What is going on in the minds and hearts of people who prefer fantasy to fact regarding Tarot origins?

That's not actually what I asked. Personally I see a huge difference between fantasy and myth. Myth has a power over both the individual psyche and culture as a whole. It is not just a 'made-up' fiction but is based on elemental themes and usually recounts some kind of origin-story the basis of which appears similarly in many cultures. A fantasy gains power beyond the individual who fabricates it only in accord with how much it is tied in to eternal myths and serves the culture.

 

[Richard]

That's not actually what I asked. Personally I see a huge difference between fantasy and myth. Myth has a power over both the individual psyche and culture as a whole. It is not just a 'made-up' fiction but is based on elemental themes and usually recounts some kind of origin-story the basis of which appears similarly in many cultures. A fantasy gains power beyond the individual who fabricates it only in accord with how much it is tied in to eternal myths and serves the culture.

I make a distinction between fantasy and myth, but I see myth as something less specialized than gypsies bringing Tarot out of Egypt. A myth has cross-cultural parallels, such as that between Isis and Mary or Sirius and the Star of Bethlehem. I don't see the same sort of universality in the gypsy story, but I may be seeing only part of the picture.

BTW, I just used the term that seemed most appropriate to me. I have no interest is raising an issue over semantics. If myth is the right word, then myth it is.

 

[Teheuti]

I make a distinction between fantasy and myth, but I see myth as something less specialized than gypsies bringing Tarot out of Egypt. A myth has cross-cultural parallels, such as that between Isis and Mary or Sirius and the Star of Bethlehem. I don't see the same sort of universality in the gypsy story, but I may be seeing only part of the picture.

The myth has more to do with "wisdom out of Egypt." The gypsies were seen as a mysterious, wandering tribe of outcasts (Magi who had lost their way)--they may well have been part of the 'untouchable' cast of India--who carry, unbeknownst to them (or known but hidden), a great treasure. They are particular manifestations that fit perfectly into a larger mythic pattern.

 

[Teheuti]

In a sense, the creators of the tarot myth fashioned a particular story about a relatively modern cultural phenomenon out of elements much older than the tarot--elements that characterize what has been called "the underground stream" of seekers after wisdom. To me the core tarot stories achieve mythic status in that they continue to serve some kind of important function in the minds of those who are drawn to the divinatory tarot, and tend to infuriate others--a sure sign that something powerful is going on.

 

[Richard]

I see your point.

 

[Teheuti]

Don't mean to get off topic again, but I just found this book, which might add more to the whole debate:

Kabbalah in Italy: 1280-1510 by Moshe Idel

http://yalepress.yale.edu/book.asp?isbn=9780300126266

Idel brings to light the rich history of Kabbalah in Italy and the powerful influence of this important center on the emergence of Christian Kabbalah and European occultism in general.

Moshe Idel is Max Cooper Professor in the Department of Jewish Thought, Hebrew University, Jerusalem, and senior researcher at the Shalom Hartman Institute. He has received many awards, including the National Jewish Book Award, for his previous books on Kabbalah. He lives in Jerusalem.

 

[Huck]

Don't mean to get off topic again, but I just found this book, which might add more to the whole debate:

Kabbalah in Italy: 1280-1510 by Moshe Idel

http://yalepress.yale.edu/book.asp?isbn=9780300126266

Idel brings to light the rich history of Kabbalah in Italy and the powerful influence of this important center on the emergence of Christian Kabbalah and European occultism in general.

Moshe Idel is Max Cooper Professor in the Department of Jewish Thought, Hebrew University, Jerusalem, and senior researcher at the Shalom Hartman Institute. He has received many awards, including the National Jewish Book Award, for his previous books on Kabbalah. He lives in Jerusalem.

The description of the book presents 3 names:

Idel analyzes the work of three major Kabbalists—Abraham Abulafia, Menahem Recanati, and Yohanan Alemanno—who represent diverse schools of thought: the ecstatic, the theosophical-theurgical, and the astromagical.

Abraham Abulafia

In obedience to an inner voice, he went in 1280 to Rome, in order to effect the conversion of Pope Nicholas III. on the day before New Year, 5041. The pope, then in Suriano, heard of it, and issued orders to burn the fanatic as soon as he reached that place. Close to the inner gate the stake was erected in preparation; but not in the least disturbed, Abulafia set out for Suriano and reached there August 22. While passing through the outer gate, he heard that the pope had succumbed to an apoplectic stroke during the preceding night. Returning to Rome, he was thrown into prison by the Minorites, but was liberated after four weeks' detention. He was next heard of in Sicily, where he appeared as a prophet and Messiah. This claim was put an end to by a letter to the people of Palermo, which most energetically condemned Abulafia's conduct. It was written by R. Solomon ben Adret, who strove with all his power to guide men's minds aright in that trying time of hysterical mental confusion. Abulafia had to take up the pilgrim's staff anew, and under distressing conditions compiled his "Sefer ha-Ot" (The Book of the Sign) on the little island of Comino, near Malta, 1285-88. In 1291 he wrote his last, and perhaps his most intelligible, work, "Imre Shefer" (Words of Beauty); after this all trace of him is lost.

http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/view.jsp?artid=699&letter=A&search=abraham Abulafia#ixzz1OU0xmMdU

Abulafia is well known for his Spanish activities. His Italian escapade (5 years) was a sort of catastrophe.

Menahem Recanati

Menahem ben Benjamin Recanati (1250-1310) was an Italian rabbi who flourished at the close of the thirteenth century and in the early part of the fourteenth. He was the only Italian of his time who devoted the chief part of his writings to the Kabbala.

The accent is here on "was the only Italian of his time" and that surely doesn't say, that there was much cabala interests in Italy.

Yohanan Alemanno

... (born in Constantinople, c. 1435 – died after 1504) was an Italian Jewish humanist philosopher and exegete, and teacher of the Hebrew language to Italian humanists including Pico della Mirandola.

It's well known, that Pico de Mirandola had Jewish teachers. The description says, that Alemanno was Jewish humanist philosopher and exegete, and taught Hebrew language. His engagement in cabala (if there was something like this) seems to be more in the background, it isn't mentioned by the wikipedia article.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yohanan_Alemanno

The book is written about Italian cabala between 1280 and 1510 and actually it seems to confirm the opinion, that there wasn't much.

The note "Idel brings to light the rich history of Kabbalah in Italy" (likely the advertising text of the publisher) looks like irony ... ... but maybe Idel has found lots of new material.
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moshe_Idel
Moshe Idel is a well respected author with lots of texts about cabala ...
http://www.google.de/search?q=moshe...gc.r_pw.&fp=136522b8a5e32801&biw=1680&bih=902

But generally: it seems likely, that compared to cabala in Spain Italy hadn't much cabala.

************

I don't think, that the cabala theme is "off-topic", as it is just a very good example of a very dominant and influential Tarot-myth, perhaps one should conclude, that it is the strongest (considering for instance, that we have a well visited Forum about the Thoth Tarot here and another about Rider-Waite-Smith and both make a lot of the cabala-Tarot connection; and furthermore we have also a Forum about cabala).

Myth aren't usually "timeless" - in contrast to an earlier statement. They have mostly an author, who started the myth. Naturally, for some myths (or the most of them) we don't know any author ... but this doesn't change the general condition.

For the Tarot-Cabala myth we have Eliphas Levi (1855; myth "French order")) and the papers of the Golden Dawn (1887; likely Kenneth Mackenzie; "English - or Golden-Dawn-order").

 

[Richard]

.....I don't think, that the cabala theme is "off-topic", as it is just a very good example of a very dominant and influential Tarot-myth, perhaps one should conclude, that it is the strongest (considering for instance, that we have a well visited Forum about the Thoth Tarot here and another about Rider-Waite-Smith and both make a lot of the cabala-Tarot connection; and furthermore we have also a Forum about cabala).....

Of course Kabbalah is a relevant Tarot myth, but I thought the original topic of this thread was why people prefer myth to truth? (And yes, I know that myths embody truth, but it is metaphorical rather than literal. (Oh man! trying to cover all possibilities of misunderstanding gets tiresome. ))

 

[Teheuti]

I thought the original topic of this thread was why people prefer myth to truth? (And yes, I know that myths embody truth, but it is metaphorical rather than literal. (Oh man! trying to cover all possibilities of misunderstanding gets tiresome. ))

The question is not why people prefer myth to truth - although it's an interesting question in its own right and could be asked of James Wanless, for instance. The question is more about what people get out of the myth (which suggests that they don't get the same thing out of the factual history). How do the Tarot myths serve the imaginations and self-concepts of many who are drawn to reading the tarot?

I would say that tarot authors and teachers, who know there is more to the history than they want to bother with, prefer the myths because they provide a short-hand method of giving students the essence of what the teacher wants to convey as the spiritual-mystical-magical dimension of the cards--a "truth" beyond the literal. No one knows how tarot divination works (no matter your personal favorite explanation - like projection or entanglement or synchronicity). But we all know that astonishing and exciting things happen in a reading with some regularity. Myths attempt to respond to what reason can't.