BLFO
I know it is the most common position, especially in the Celtic Cross deck, but doesn't it annoy you? I mean, we all know what we desire and hope for. So what is the point in having this position?
Best You Can Hope For
finaflight
I have been wondering about this myself lately. The most important cards to me are the first 2.
I need to know what is blocking me from what it is I desire/ need to know.
The outcome to me has something to do with these two cards and so sometimes I feel like just pulling the first 2 and the outcome - and skip the rest
sigh...but i dont.
I need to know what is blocking me from what it is I desire/ need to know.
The outcome to me has something to do with these two cards and so sometimes I feel like just pulling the first 2 and the outcome - and skip the rest
sigh...but i dont.
Vadella
It's useful when reading for someone else. You know this. lol
Cosmo- I've done that before... a long time ago.
lol Cosmo- I've done that before... a long time ago.
balenciaga
BLFO said:
I know I will sound like a ding-dong, but which position is this? The outcome (#10)?
Disa
Hopes and Fears, I thought, #9. and 10 is the outcome.
Harfang
soooo many possibilities (as always )
I learned #9 as more your inner hopes and fears, sometimes subconscious ones; so not as utopian as Disa's version... However, when I started learning to read, my resource was the LWB that came with the Medieval Scapini. Fortunately, Stuart Kaplan wrote it; unfortunately, he's pretty old school and rigid in some ways with how he sees the cards. He can write an LWB with the deck at hand in mind pretty well (the St. Petersburg is another good example of this), but his viewpoint doesn't seem super adaptable.
To me #10 doesn't have to be the best you can hope for; I've also read it as a warning, a probable but not fatal-doomy outcome that the querent is advised to attempt to avert.
)I learned #9 as more your inner hopes and fears, sometimes subconscious ones; so not as utopian as Disa's version... However, when I started learning to read, my resource was the LWB that came with the Medieval Scapini. Fortunately, Stuart Kaplan wrote it; unfortunately, he's pretty old school and rigid in some ways with how he sees the cards. He can write an LWB with the deck at hand in mind pretty well (the St. Petersburg is another good example of this), but his viewpoint doesn't seem super adaptable.
To me #10 doesn't have to be the best you can hope for; I've also read it as a warning, a probable but not fatal-doomy outcome that the querent is advised to attempt to avert.
starrystarrynight
Are you talking about the Hopes and Fears position or the Crown card?
I'm thinking you may be talking about the Crown card (that's the one placed above the Situation card--#5, the way I set out a Celtic Cross.)
I've also seen it described as the "best the seeker can hope for" in the situation, but I tend to see it more as the hidden energies that may or may not manifest, but will influence the situation if nothing is done to alter them. I guess this can be seen as the best the seeker can hope for, but it's not as definite or direct as the outcome card.
I'm thinking you may be talking about the Crown card (that's the one placed above the Situation card--#5, the way I set out a Celtic Cross.)
I've also seen it described as the "best the seeker can hope for" in the situation, but I tend to see it more as the hidden energies that may or may not manifest, but will influence the situation if nothing is done to alter them. I guess this can be seen as the best the seeker can hope for, but it's not as definite or direct as the outcome card.
Shaymus
I wonder if BLFO was referring to the crowning position (#5). I read somewhere that this could also mean this.
Shaymus
Shaymus
Esther
None of the Celtic Cross layouts I've seen have used this exact wording for a position. The only ones I can think of are the hopes and/or fears card (#9) and the outcome card (#10). The latter seems more divinatory--saying exactly what to expect. If a CC spread has that card labeled as "The best you can hope for," maybe what they mean by that is what kind of outcome you can expect, rather than what you're hoping will happen.
As for the former, call my crazy, but I've actually found it revealing, even in self-readings. But then, I also like to use the CC more as a self-reflection spread. Sometimes you think you know what's on your mind going into a reading, but while looking at the cards, you realize it's a bit deeper and end up thinking about the situation in new ways. I think these are some of the most helpful readings. Sometimes that position in the CC has shown me that the reading was actually about something else, as well. I'd start out reading about one thing, but reading the cards, I'd see that they seemed to be talking about something else going on my life. A lot of times, that's the card that confirms it what the cards are talking about.
As for the former, call my crazy, but I've actually found it revealing, even in self-readings. But then, I also like to use the CC more as a self-reflection spread. Sometimes you think you know what's on your mind going into a reading, but while looking at the cards, you realize it's a bit deeper and end up thinking about the situation in new ways. I think these are some of the most helpful readings. Sometimes that position in the CC has shown me that the reading was actually about something else, as well. I'd start out reading about one thing, but reading the cards, I'd see that they seemed to be talking about something else going on my life. A lot of times, that's the card that confirms it what the cards are talking about.
LixiPixi
I agree on the #5 crowning position being the "one that can best be hoped for" (given the current situation) as opposed to the #10 outcome card.
While I can see the "uselessness" of the #5 position in that specific terminology, I've found that various CC versions are worded differently and therefore, give the positions a little more clarity or even can make them more confusing depending on which version of the CC you follow.
Although, it's still not my "favorite" version of the CC, I've found that the Gilded Tarot has a really good one. It seems so often that the card/number placement isn't always the same in the various materials and that has made it confusing for me. I have a layout that I tend to follow and at the same time (for the time being) use the positions as given in the Gilded.
Anyway, I think the key to your dilemma is finding a CC layout with terminology that suits you best, then, following that as your "norm."
LP~
While I can see the "uselessness" of the #5 position in that specific terminology, I've found that various CC versions are worded differently and therefore, give the positions a little more clarity or even can make them more confusing depending on which version of the CC you follow.
Although, it's still not my "favorite" version of the CC, I've found that the Gilded Tarot has a really good one. It seems so often that the card/number placement isn't always the same in the various materials and that has made it confusing for me. I have a layout that I tend to follow and at the same time (for the time being) use the positions as given in the Gilded.
Anyway, I think the key to your dilemma is finding a CC layout with terminology that suits you best, then, following that as your "norm."
LP~
