Curiousity about Anti-Tarot Christian Sentiment...

[serenaserendipity]

Hello everyone--

Recently I have encountered a couple of instances of Christian-based anti-tarot sentiment.

Perhaps I am naive, but I felt a bit surprised about this. Any thoughts on what it might be based on?

The first instance had to do with an acquaintance. I was describing a difficult situation in my life, which I have often turned to tarot cards regarding, in my process of dealing with it. The acquaintance remarked, "Well, that's not the way to deal with a dark situation. You don't want to turn to tarot cards for that. You don't want to fight darkness with more darkness!"

I was surprised by this response, because I have never considered Tarot Cards to be "dark". For me they very obviously, similar to something like the Daoist Yin-Yang, correlate to both difficult and happy situations in life.

More recently, my friend and I were at a coffeeshop we like to frequent, and there we found some little comic books published by a Christian propoganda company. One we found to be quite funny- it featured the tale of two teenage wannabe witches, who get "saved" by their Christian uncle. After the first gets saved, she then burns her tarot cards.

Perhaps it is simply because I have always felt a bit overwhelmed by historical descriptions of the way women who were identified as being witches were treated throughout time--

but I felt very disturbed by the basis of this comic book's intent, even if the vehicle of it was innocuous enough...

I also felt a bit paranoid, since my friend and I wear bohemian clothing, and often sit and discuss psychological issues, and sometimes read Rumi outloud or look at a book about palm reading or something like that... it doesn't seem particularly "witchy" to me to do those things, but maybe someone else would interpret it differently...

Anyhow, I realize some people unconsciously identify me as a witch, since I have black hair, and have a confident aura, and live a different sort of lifestyle... I guess I am not afraid of that perse, even though I don't identify as Wicca or any other theism for that matter...

Any thoughts about this sort of thing?

Sincerely,
Serendipity

 

[Moongold]

I have found it helpful when speaking with Christians, especially Catholics, to compare the use of iconography in religious observances and in the Tarot.

The crucifix, the statuary in churches, the use of vestments, incense and water and various other Christian icons are representative of belief and meaning. For fundamentalist Christians the symbol of the fish is often significant. This often helps to make people think gently of other possibilities of meaning for Tarot.

In the same context, Tarot, especially in the way it uses iconography, might be seen as a request to a Higher Power for *signs* or insight through the cards. The insight which comes to people sometimes in prayer can be compared to the insight which comes with Tarot. Tarot is simply another form of communication.

Of course, all this presupposes a dialogue and some openmindedness. Sometimes one needs to make a judgement about whether this is possible or even desirable with some people. Often it is better to simply leave others to their own opinions because nothing you can do will change them. And we may choose not to use energy this way.

 

[thinbuddha]

There is no question that tarot has a "bad rap"- even among agnostics. I don't advertise the fact that I read tarot cards. The fact is that it isn't really taken seriously by many people in our society (at least here in the US) and many of the people who do take it seriously are seriously afraid of the cards- as if they are somehow going to let evil into your life if you interact with them.

Most people, I find, treat it like something of a game, a game with an edge.

 

[Cerulean]

Thoughts not quite in the order proposed...

1. The acquaintance who said ..."not dark with more dark..."

Sounds like you were asking their opinion and for their wisdom, so they gave you the answer they knew or heard--might be 'conventional wisdom' for their family or circumstances--or as you described the situation. Given that your puzzlement at a personal situation seemed also involved, the aquaintance probably answered as best they can, addressing perhaps also your mixed feelings about a situation they deem as dark or confusing..

You might have suggested looking at the problem through using a reader, if you aren't experienced with tarot cards...or also expressed confusion about not only the problem, but another method for 'resolving' or 'getting another opinion.' The aquaintance might be more comfortable with a conventional wisdom such as a personal counselor or therapist, someone they consider neutral in a professional sense. Perhaps the aquaintance felt it was only responsible to suggest this in a caring manner...

2. In terms of the comic book using 'tarot' as an example.

It's easier to probably represent tossing away 'superstition' by tarot cards rather than tossing comic books or playing cards...or likely they didn't want to suggest people try to toss the Magic Eight Ball or the Ouija board you can buy from major toy companies in the fire.

3. Now my personal commentary: I do disagree with both examples above., People who care about me actually have figured my ten-to-twelve-year-old interest in tarot is quite commonplace now. For some people that I care about, if they think my interests are wacky in Western Tarot, I also point to calligraphic I-Ching or Hana Fuda or 100 Poets illustrated cards with Japanese symbols and characters. That has cultural inheritance attached to it. Since I don't gamble, drink, smoke or seem to invoke cheerfulness rather than glumness, and my family relations are good--my interests are not considered evil, mean or strange. So my suggestion is to enjoy your hobbies and browsing without worrying too much about other people's opinions.

4. In terms of your reading material or conversational content such as Rumi or psychology, it's quite common for artistic or creatives---I wouldn't think anyone would think twice about that. Rumi is one of the best selling poets in the last few years, I've heard from poetry fans. If you and your friend are worried about being overheard, you can both speak softly or choose places less populated than crowded malls and cafes to meet...

5. Bohemian clothing...confidant aura.

That's fine and wonderful! I glanced at your profile, which said you were a musician--if you are used to performing in public and have an ability to project charisma and confidence, that alone probably makes for attentive second looks. People who like tarot usually look like most other people, in my aquaintance--they might be more visually oriented in their interests, though.

6....and being identified as a witch...

I'm not certain what you mean. Perhaps your clothing is Neo-Gothic or Retro Goth and they aren't used to that? Maybe they think you and your friend look like an actress from Charmed or one of those television shows and are trying to guess which sister you are. If someone wants to be identified with a religious or spiritual belief, it's usually by them wearing symbols of their faith rather than a costume...

Hope you enjoy any discussion you encounter here and hope my answers weren't too out of the way for you.

Best regards,

Cerulean

 

[Abrac]

The Tarot is at the top of the evangelical Christian hit list for several reasons.

1. Thou shalt not make any graven images - Bible
2. Only certain forms of divination were sanctioned by God in the Bible, the Tarot is certainly not one of them. 3. Cards in general are anathema for hard-line Christians because they are associated with gambling and idleness. 4. Many of the images on the Tarot represent pagan deities, which a lot of Christians hate. 5. Tarot is associated with the occult and magic. No explanation needed here. 6. If you get guidance from the Tarot you don't necessarily have to look to the Christian God for that advice. Some people do, but it's not a requirement. This is unacceptable to a lot of Christians because in their minds, their God is the only way. Everything else is of Satan, and therefore evil. I've always kinda liked evil though myself.

To sum up, the Tarot represents just about everything evangelical Christians hate.

-fof

 

[serenaserendipity]

Thanks everybody!

Thanks you guys, for your comments about anti-tarot sentiment...

Moongold, I think it is apt to point out that Christian iconography is present in Tarot symbolism...

I also find perhaps that Tarot is more easily integrated by those with a pan-theist viewpoint...

I also find the main idea of Gnosticism, which is basically early Christianity, is that each person can have their own individual relationship with the Higher Power-- which gives credence to the idea of the dialogue with the Divine, but maybe threatens the church's stance that the church be the interlocuter (is that the right word?)

By the way Cerulean, your comments were sensitive and also made me laugh! Seems like you have an inordinate amount of compassion which allows you to see into people's motives...

Thanks everybody,, I really appreciate your insight!

Sincerely,
Serendipity

 

[MikeTheAltarboy]

Serenaserendipity,

Sorry that you've encountered anti-tarotness from some segments of christianity. However, since I'm a devout tarot-reading orthodox christian myself, and see no problems with it, I prefer to just see it as *some people* have tarot issues. Just because they blame their issues on "their christianity" doesn't mean christianity really has anything to do with it. ;-)

Now, fools-fool is quite right, in terms of "evangelicals." Although they're the loudest, I'd hope they're not the norm.

I'm a bit confused by your statement about gnosticism, though. I'd say the notion that every person can have their own relationship with God is pretty *standard* christian - both in the past, and now. The "church" in christian myth always means the body of christians - not a governing body. My understanding of gnosticism is that they believed that we were trapped in an evil world, and needed, by our own striving, to escape from it; opposed to the christian view of a fallen, yet still "and-it-was-good" world, which is redeamed by God's grace.

 

[TheLovers2]

Simply knee-jerk responses, I think.

The Tarot is at the top of the evangelical Christian hit list for several reasons.

5. Tarot is associated with the occult and magic. No explanation needed here. 6. If you get guidance from the Tarot you don't necessarily have to look to the Christian God for that advice. Some people do, but it's not a requirement. This is unacceptable to a lot of Christians because in their minds, their God is the only way. Everything else is of Satan, and therefore evil. I've always kinda liked evil though myself.

To sum up, the Tarot represents just about everything evangelical Christians hate.

-fof

Being a Christian, myself, I just want to say that, yes, many . . . well, just about every Christian I know does see the cards as "something dark, sinister, out-of-line with Christianity." Yep, and one of the reasons is that they do associate it with occult and magic, dark influences, etc. To them it's all one big pot of soup and it's a soup deemed the same, regardless of the recipe or cook. It's just bad; which is a source of frustration for me. I do NOT talk to most of my Christian friends and acquaintances about my views/interest in Tarot.

Also, as FOF stated, many will assume that one is forsaking prayer and seeking God for wisdom and answers, in order to seek answers from the Tarot, as a kind of replacement. In my life, nothing could be further from the truth. There is no "replacing," prayer or my faith in God. Tarot is not God (not to me anyway). It's rather like . . . well . . . many things, but, suffice it to say, it's rather like a support system. It would probably do me no good to try to explain this to my well-meaning, well-intentioned Christian brothers and sisters. Christians often find it difficult to believe that "help," "insight," even "wisdom," can come from any other source. Perhaps, it's not so much a different source as just a different vehicle being used to get the information across.

So . . . like FOF said, just about anything, other than the Bible or Christian related literature, is suspect. I have even heard of people having a problem with "too much positive thinking," "creative visualization," etc. The biggest problem I see with attitudes, such as your acquaintance has, is that they leave no room for YOU or ME; but, simply who they think you are and what they believe you're all about, as though they know your heart; and they do not even consider that as a Christian, one may also be balanced.

I've been a Christian for a lot of years and I simply find things to be not so black and white, but, with lots of gray and brown and pink areas, you know.

Personally, I feel that Tarot cards make an easy target and there is a sort of knee-jerk response to it. The thing (and I don't ever intend to forget it), is that often you will not know what is in their "closets."

TL2

 

[firecatpickles]

I am Christian but not a fundamentalist, so I feel I can add something here...

I believe that people with closed minds would be able to find something "wrong" with others, no matter what, because they can always proof text the Bible to suit their agendas, instead of interpreting (or even allowing others to interpret) the Bible as a historical document, and what the passages in this book meant to people living within that particular time period.

If it isn't tarot in their sites, it is some other superficial (superificial in religious terms, not real life application), non-related issue, such as sexuality, women's rights, race-relations --the list could go on seemingly forever. The word that is beyond the fundalmentalist grasp is "diversity." Diversity yields tolerance. As long as there is intolerance in the world, there will be abuse.

As someone mentioned before, it is a power struggle. Threatened? Remove the threat. Fight, or flight. The threat of tarot lies in its competition with the "fast-food mentality" of modern Christianity, in other words ("ask God for it and 'ye shall receive'"). But God does not give us what we want but what we need.

This issue is a real sore-spot for me, because it has been (and continues to be) an uphill battle reconciling my natural, true "pagan" self with my conditioned and learned "theosophic" one. Both are a palpable part of me that I can't do without. No one can take away a part of me...

KK

 

[Azoth]

A certain culture.

There exsists a certain culture within Christianity (and indeed any group, following, people, religion, etc.) of avoidance. Unfortunately it is commonplace for people to enter into an 'interest' or 'religion' to avoid looking at part of their life which they find uncomfortable. It seems to me that when a Christian 'warns' against the Tarot, they are attempting to extend this negative culture (burying ones head in the sands of faith). It is an attitude which I find both tiresome and ignorant, although no doubt I have hidden behind something in avoidance myself on more than one occassion!