Figuring it out

[Red Emma]

I guess I need some insights. The last three years my solar return readings have all been on tapes. That is the astrologer taped her discussion about my year ahead. Later, when I listen to it, I intend to annotate the discussions as to the time of the year when certain things can be expected.

This is not what happens. As I listen, I write down her first comments about a certain time ahead -- August, say, but then her discussion gets involved with the ins and outs, the minutae (sp?), what part of August might be ameliorated or intensifed by other planets in their various phases. Those planets, of course, are on a different time schedule.

I just plain get confused and drop my pencil. Actually, I want to throw it across the room.

Right now some stuff is happening in my daily life I'd like to compare with the tape. I keep thinking I'll listen to it, but the thing is, my own time schedule prevents it.

I've thought of typing the tape when first I get it. That way I could scan the typed version to find what I'm looking for. However! Typing from a tape is a very diffiicult skill. One I don't seem to have.

Can anyone suggest how to do the annotations when I first listen to the tape at home?

All suggestions gratefully accepted!

 

[rainwolf]

A clarity note;

so you have an astrologer that sends you tapes of your solar returns, but your astrologer talks about the different planets*

is your problem that it is too specific, or that you dont understand the planets and what they are doing?

 

[leephd]

Is it software, or *soft*ware?

There is message-taking software that has been developed for taking notes and annotation, as college students might like to do. Here's an example: http://www.lecturerecorder.com/

However, like Rainwolf, I'm not entirely sure this is the problem. Among astrologers, the interpretation of solar returns is a hugely hot button. There are an absolute ton of different technical delineation methods. Over and over I have heard astrologers (privately) throwing up their hands at solar returns and saying that they cannot get consistent results with them, even about the big-picture items, let alone trying to do monthly or daily timing off them. Unfortunately, once an astrologer goes into practice, she or he may not be clear about which components of the system used are "working," and which are not.

If you are following the tape and getting mud, you have to stop and consider that it might actually be mud, even if other components of that astrologer's reading work like gangbusters.

 

[Minderwiz]

Lee may well have put her finger on the problem here. If the problem lies not with you but with the Interpretations you could try two alternatives.

Firstly there is the Dave (dadsnook2000) approach of adjusting the returns for progression. The main argument being that as we grow older the difference between the solar return as measured sidereally and the solar return as measured tropically widens, to the detriment of the tropical interpretation. It's probable that your astrologer uses standard tropical solar returns, so a change of technique or a change of astrologer might help.

Secondly, as I too find solar returns can be confusing because of the variety of ways that the data could be interpreted. I would use a horary astrology approach. Providing that you can indentify specific questions that are important to you and need answering, this can not only be far more accurate in terms of useful answers but also give far more specifically useful information (assuming that you've got a good Astrologer). The downside is that you may need to have more frequent consultations - though these can be done by post/telephone/email/etc and they can be done fairly quickly by a good practioner.

 

[Red Emma]

Figure it out

Boy, did I screw up that explanation, and I'm supposed to be a professional communicator!

It's not the interpretation at all, but ... How to explain?

The last two years, local women -- well thought of in their profession -- have done it for me. As we talked a tape recorder was running. When I take the tape home, I've made efforts to type it out and make a chart of the variety: I can expect X in August, and Y in September.

THE FOLLOWING IS COMPLETELY MADE UP as you will understand when you see where I put planets, in what houses, and all that stuff. You can easily say my knowledge of the subject is minimal.

But say Venus is in my 5th house from July 23 to August 30. So I write in my little chart the impact that will probably have on my life.

But, along comes another planet, say Mars, which will impact that 7/23 to 8/30 Venus stuff. Mars will be around say, from 8/15 to 9/25.

ACTUALLY, I KNOW WHAT I WANT TO DO, BUT I DON'T KNOW HOW TO EXPLAIN IT. MAYBE WE SHOULD JUST FORGET MY WHOLE QUESTION AND PRETEND I SLEPT THROUGH YESTERDAY......DIDN'T CREATE A NEW ASTROLOGY THREAD AT ALL.

CHEERS, GUYS. SORRY TO BE SO IGNORANT. THANKS FOR TRYING TO HELP.

RED EMMA WITH A RED FACE.

 

[dadsnook2000]

Its probably not "you".

From what you have said, I would expect that your "astrological consultants" are not being clear and concise with you. Too many use "astro-babble" and lack clarity in their stated times and events.

I would also suspect that they are using conventional Solar Returns. I use a much different approach and have done many charts and event-defininition (a better term than prediction) work on a thread that I co-moderate, a yahoo groups site called Tarot Transits. As Minderwiz noted, the difference between Solar Return charts grows greater as we age each year, the Sidereal Return chart ocurring later and later each year than the Tropical Solar Return. The difference in timing and what planets are angular can be stunning. Sidereal practice makes astrology "work" simply, easily, clearly. I'm a little busy over the next several days, but if you would promise to give feedback here, I would be happy to show you how it all works. Dave.

If you wish, just PM me your data.

 

[Minderwiz]

CHEERS, GUYS. SORRY TO BE SO IGNORANT. THANKS FOR TRYING TO HELP.

RED EMMA WITH A RED FACE.

LOTS OF HUGS!!!! Emma, there's absolutely no need to apologise at all - indeed I would think that you are a rather typical client trying to get your head round what you have paid for (in some way or other).

From what you tried to say, is the problem more one of trying to integrate a whole series of separate statements about what planets are doing individually at any desired date? - how do you reconcile the bit about Venus with the bit about Mars (and all the other bits that are going on at the same time).

If there's a specific issue that you are concerned with then I really would suggest a horary reading.

 

[Red Emma]

Figuring it out...

LOTS OF HUGS!!!!

From what you tried to say, is the problem more one of trying to integrate a whole series of separate statements about what planets are doing individually at any desired date? - how do you reconcile the bit about Venus with the bit about Mars (and all the other bits that are going on at the same time). QUOTE]

Thanks for the hugs. One can never have too many.

And you're exactly right about reconciling what planets are doing at any desired date. That's where I go crazy.

However, I listened to my latest tape this afternoon and discovered a couple of things which a more skilled communicator would have handled differently. Or at least I would have.

First, she had two or three pieces of paper with my chart, but each had different colored lines in the -- well, I'd call it the core. That empty space in the center. She had described to me before she remembered to turn on the tape, about (triangles? She didn't call them triangles but that what they look like to me. Also there were some places which she said were karmic.)

She would point to one of these different ?triangles? and tell me about it saying, "This means...." Which was okay when I was in the room with her and could see what she was pointing to, but when I got home "this" was impossible to identify.

After listening to you guys, I can see that she's probably an okay astrologer, but not a gifted communicator.

About her astrology, as I listened this afternoon, I realized that some of the things she told me have certainly come to pass. (She did the reading in mid-January.)

Dadsnook is doing a chart for me -- probably not the right terminology -- which I'll be interested in seeing.

I don't know the meaning of terms like horary or Dadsnook's suggestion, sidereal. (I'm not sure of the spelling.) Heck, forget the spelling. I have no idea what it is.

Anyhow, you've all been very kind and it's much appreciated.

Blessings,

Emma

 

[Minderwiz]

An Alternative Approach

I'll just deal with the 'horary'

This is sort of like a tarot reading, in the sense that you ask a specific question - one that is particularly concerning you - and the Astrologer casts a chart for that question and then uses the chart to give you an answer.

The benefit is that there is no confusion with other issues or trends in your life - just the single issue is examined and you get an answer that you can easily understand (even if it's not the answer you would have liked).

Thus if your pet cat goes missing, you can ask the question 'will Tiddles come back?' and get a specific answer, rather than looking at all the transits going on at the moment and trying to disentangle which, if any, are relevant or even having to have Tiddle's natal chart handy and have her transits calculated.

 

[dadsnook2000]

Solar-Returns; simplicity & complexity

As promised, I'm going to look at Solar Returns using my precession corrected Returns and progression techniques. Let me first provide an overview of what this thread/response (and probably a couple more to follow) will cover:

1) A quick look at the natal chart to see what significant patterns exist. The object isn't so much to do a detailed natal chart analysis but to see what the primary chart forces consist of.

2) A look at the 2006 S/R chart (precession corrected) and what it signifies all by itself.

3) A review of how to do daily progressions between the 2006 and the 2007 S/R charts.

4) A look at the upcoming contacts between transiting/natal planets and the moving angles of the progressed S/R chart.

To help with this process I will scan and send Emma simple chart diagrams and a table to help determine when an angle (on what day) will contact a given planet position.

THE NATAL CHART
The astrological bodies are scattered about the chart yet there are several significant factors that stand out.
** Sun-Pluto-NNode in the 10th house; suggesting a self-disciplined, goal oriented person.
** Sun-Pluto-NNode square Mars/7th; vigorous, self-achiever, takes charge in relationships.
** Pluto sesqiquadrate (square & a half) Saturn; firmness, one who is absorbed in oneself, modesty.
** Sun semi-square Neptune; sensitivity, mystic, seeing several realities.

This complex points to both a strong person who can set the tone for a relationship as well as one who has her own views on what life can be and how it can be shaped. Yet, the outward sense of modesty and firmness exists. There is another pattern that needs to be noted, also.

** Jupiter opposite Neptune, both squared by Saturn; Several interpretive approaches can be applied to this pattern. Likely, the whole range of meanings can be felt and experienced over time. Ebertin would note that this pattern brings a drain on the person's life, pessimism, dealing with disillusionment, etc. The more positive view would be that idealism and wishes might conflict with actual opportunities, resulting in life's realities interfering such that opportunities are lost or idealism isn't brought into reality.

Finally, lets take a brief look at the Moon.
** Moon in the 5th; one who might love creative environments or admire those who work in creative fields.
** Moon approaching the opening square to Saturn; you tend to search for an identity that will help you seperate yourself from the past (family, early life or previously disliked circumstances). The wide conjunction with Jupiter might signify a cheerful attitude toward life.

In my next posting we will look at the 2006 Solar Return. Note that in these comments I have not refered at all to the "signs" that are on the angles or the signs that the planets are located in. In the following posts, I will note the signs-degrees of both the Tropical and Sidereal charts and point out the differences that occur between the two systems in terms of Solar Return charts. Dave