The Hierophant: Hand Position in RW & Thoth

[Centaur]

I was looking at the Hierophant in the Crowley Thoth, and the RW, and I noticed a little something about his hand.

In the RW, his right-arm is raised and his fingers point to the sky. However, in the Thoth, his left arm is pointing downwards, and his fingers are poiting at the ground. His hand is in the same position in both.

As far as I am aware the Hierophant in the RW is pointing at the Heavens. What is the Crowley interpretation of the downward pointing hand?

Anyone know if this has any relevance and if this difference perhaps reveals insight into the differing beliefs held by Crowley and Waite?

C

 

[DeLani]

Hmmm...not sure about the difference between which way the hand is pointing...maybe someone else can enligten us on that.
But the hand position, as far as I know, is what would be called in yoga a "mudra," or hand position that means something specific. It is the mudra the Pope and other priests use to bless. I think it is also where the peace sign originated.
When I get back from Lon Milo DuQuette's talk tonight, I should have more info!

 

[Centaur]

Quote:Originally posted by DeLani
But the hand position, as far as I know, is what would be called in yoga a "mudra," or hand position that means something specific. It is the mudra the Pope and other priests use to bless. I think it is also where the peace sign originated.
When I get back from Lon Milo DuQuette's talk tonight, I should have more info!

I think it is very interesting that on the RW it is pointing upwards, yet on the Thoth it is pointing downwards. I am sure that there must be some reason for this.

Have fun at DuQuette's talk! Lucky you!

C

 

[DeLani]

Well, I asked Lon Milo DuQuette, who's quite an expert on Crowley and the Thoth deck, and he said he didn't know. He thought maybe it might be that in Crowley's mind, the Hierophant would be more active than the RW version. But that's about it.

 

[Imagemaker]

This is like climbing all the way to the top of the Himalayas to see the mystical Guru to ask the secret of life, and he says, "I'm working on it."

Aaagh! I wanted more!

 

[Emily]

I've had a quick look in The Book of Thoth, which I'm trying to read at the moment, and the hand position isn't mentioned in there either.

 

[Major Tom]

Here's what I think:

Add the hand position of The Pope from a Tarot of Marseille which also has the same hand position but a different arm position.

Have you ever seen the Pope and the blessing he gives to a large crowd or the blessing he gives the land he visits?

In each instance we're seeing the same blessing - just at different moments.

 

[Centaur]

Quote:Originally posted by DeLani
Well, I asked Lon Milo DuQuette, who's quite an expert on Crowley and the Thoth deck, and he said he didn't know. He thought maybe it might be that in Crowley's mind, the Hierophant would be more active than the RW version. But that's about it.

Thanks for asking.

I think that his explanation might have some grounding. In the RW, the Hierophant is pointing upwards, and thus to the realm of the spirit, or the mind. In the Thoth he is pointing downwards, to the realm of the physical, and of action.

UP: Spirit, thought, mind, imagination...

DOWN: Material, physical, doing, earthly, action...

Hmnnn... kind of like a see-saw.

I want DuQuette's book too... I have heard that it is excellent.

C

 

[Centaur]

I was walking past a church today, and I happened to glance at one of the stained glass windows. In it, there was depicted an image of christ with his hand in the same position as that of the RW Hierophant.

I then got to thinking that perhaps Crowley depicted this same position in the opposite direction due to his supposed dislike for christianity.

Any thoughts?

 

[Rusty Neon]

In _Handbook to the Cards_, Banzhaf gives his take. I don't have the book handy. Perhaps someone can volunteer.