A Dummies Guide to Historical Research

[Rosanne]

Lol Umbrae- I have met you and you are Wow Wow not woo woo. Someone cannot spell. It needs figuring out this what is expected of m here. Then I Know! It is as I have always said to my herd whilst they are growing up- "Blame me- blame your Mum! Then no one can attack you - when things go Pear shaped- it is my fault you cannot do, say, go where your mates suggest- tell them it is me -I am the bitch!!!"
It will work here too!
Love you too and thanks for braving the waters.
~Rosanne

 

[le pendu]

Well you know, I feel that if you don't deal with trolls fairly firmly then it can be a bit of a "Night of the Zombies" scenario. Next thing, they're everywhere, lumbering towards you. Then before you know it it's just jmd and le Pendu holed up with Moonbow* in the Thoth forum with jmd saying, "I've got two bullets left Moonbow*. If they break in here I want you to know that I'll use one on you and then the last one on myself". Which leaves le Pendu saying, "Er, excuse me a minute..." and wondering bleakly what life as someone who has "gone over" will be like. It sure won't be a bed of roses.

You've got to take a firm stand before it gets to that point girl.

Come on now Baba, I think you're pushing this zom.....

Oh my God! Oh my God!!!

Dummett!! Dummett!!! Italy 1500s!!!! AHHHHHHHH!!!!!!

AHHHHHHHHH!!!!!

The tarot is obviously based on the secret gnostic knowledge of the marriage of Jesus to Mary Magdalene (MM). The twin towers on the misnamed "Moon" card actually represent Jesus and MM:
"the "magdal- eder"--the "tower (stronghold) of the flock" from the prophetic passage in the Hebrew Bible --Micah 4:8-10. Since "Magdala" means "tower" in Hebrew, this passage is powerfully prophetic of the role of Mary Magdalene as the "daughter of Sion" in her role as "Bride."

"The "castle" (cit a d el) emblem originally represented the city of Jerusalem--her walls, gate, ramparts and twin towers."

http://www.magdalene.org/twintowers.phphttp://www.magdalene.org/twintowers.php

Twins, as shown in the constellation Gemini, are also connected to Pisces.
http://embryology.med.unsw.edu.au/Defect/images/Smellie_twins.jpg
http://www.ianridpath.com/startales/image/gemini.JPG
http://www.pisces.com/files/piscesfish.jpg

Fish swim in water, water is shown on the "Moon" card.
http://www.tarot.org.il/Payen/18 La Lvne.png

Water has historically been connected to Atlantis. Plato mentions Atlantis.
http://www.goldenageproject.org.uk/platoillustration.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plato
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosopher

Plato flourished at the same time as Pluto.
http://www.authorama.com/remarks-b-62.html

Plato and Pluto are both Greek
http://www.greektexts.com/library/Plato/cratylus/eng/1256.html

Plato/Pluto is the name of not only an ancient philosopher, but also one of the most famous "Disney" characters.

Who is the most beloved of the Disney characters? None other than Mickey Mouse. MM! Mickey Mouse = Mary Magdalene. Pluto, (obviously slightly reinterpreted for modern eyes), is none other than Jesus himself. Pluto was Mickey's "beloved companion". Mary Magdalene was Jesus' "beloved companion". The two together represent the two towers on the "Moon" card. It's really that simple.

Please cite my work when mentioning:
Jesus
Mary Magdalene
Mickey Mouse
Pluto
Plato
Water
Atlantis
Greeks
Cards
Fish
Gemini
Pisces
Constellations
Castles
The Bible
or Tarot

 

[prudence]

I am truly hoping to understand what is acceptable here as well....I do try to participate, as best as I can....but, I really have to agree that the overall feeling here has never been all that welcoming. It is actually frightening for me to try to create a thread or even a simple post in this forum, but maybe that is just my own self esteem issues. The idea of being ripped to shreds by an intellectual sends shivers up my spine. All of this stands in the way of my learning, which is a shame. It is one thing to read lengthy threads that are full of information, and I do that often....but to be able to ask questions in that thread, and be a participant would add to the learning experience for me.

I am saying "I" and "me", but I do believe that there are others who feel very much like I do.

 

[Rosanne]

Please site my work when mentioning:
Jesus
Mary Magdalene
Mickey Mouse
Pluto
Plato
Water
Atlantis
Greeks
Cards
Fish
Gemini
Pisces
Constellations
Castles
The Bible
or Tarot

Very funny!!!!! but this is the important bit! and what I started the thread about. ~Rosanne

 

[le pendu]

Very funny!!!!! but this is the important bit! and what I started the thread about. ~Rosanne

Right! A ridiculous request given that no actual coherent argument has been presented, published, reviewed, or accepted.

 

[baba-prague]

Come on now Baba, I think you're pushing this zom.....

Oh my God! Oh my God!!!

Dummett!! Dummett!!! Italy 1500s!!!! AHHHHHHHH!!!!!!

AHHHHHHHHH!!!!!

The tarot is obviously based on the secret gnostic knowledge of the marriage of Jesus to Mary Magdalene (MM). The twin towers on the misnamed "Moon" card actually represent Jesus and MM:
"the "magdal- eder"--the "tower (stronghold) of the flock" from the prophetic passage in the Hebrew Bible --Micah 4:8-10. Since "Magdala" means "tower" in Hebrew, this passage is powerfully prophetic of the role of Mary Magdalene as the "daughter of Sion" in her role as "Bride."

"The "castle" (cit a d el) emblem originally represented the city of Jerusalem--her walls, gate, ramparts and twin towers."

http://www.magdalene.org/twintowers.phphttp://www.magdalene.org/twintowers.php

Twins, as shown in the constellation Gemini, are also connected to Pisces.
http://embryology.med.unsw.edu.au/Defect/images/Smellie_twins.jpg
http://www.ianridpath.com/startales/image/gemini.JPG
http://www.pisces.com/files/piscesfish.jpg

Fish swim in water, water is shown on the "Moon" card.
http://www.tarot.org.il/Payen/18 La Lvne.png

Water has historically been connected to Atlantis. Plato mentions Atlantis.
http://www.goldenageproject.org.uk/platoillustration.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plato
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosopher

Plato flourished at the same time as Pluto.
http://www.authorama.com/remarks-b-62.html

Plato and Pluto are both Greek
http://www.greektexts.com/library/Plato/cratylus/eng/1256.html

Plato/Pluto is the name of not only an ancient philosopher, but also one of the most famous "Disney" characters.

Who is the most beloved of the Disney characters? None other than Mickey Mouse. MM! Mickey Mouse = Mary Magdalene. Pluto, (obviously slightly reinterpreted for modern eyes), is none other than Jesus himself. Pluto was Mickey's "beloved companion". Mary Magdalene was Jesus' "beloved companion". The two together represent the two towers on the "Moon" card. It's really that simple.

Too late, they got him. Though I have to say, that the Pluto/Plato association is starting to look pretty b*****y (full word now trademark of le pendu) convincing to me.

Ref: le pendu AT post 21st November 2007 (did I get that right?)

 

[Master_Margarita]

I am truly hoping to understand what is acceptable here as well....I do try to participate, as best as I can....but, I really have to agree that the overall feeling here has never been all that welcoming. It is actually frightening for me to try to create a thread or even a simple post in this forum, but maybe that is just my own self esteem issues. The idea of being ripped to shreds by an intellectual sends shivers up my spine. All of this stands in the way of my learning, which is a shame. It is one thing to read lengthy threads that are full of information, and I do that often....but to be able to ask questions in that thread, and be a participant would add to the learning experience for me.

I am saying "I" and "me", but I do believe that there are others who feel very much like I do.

What's going on is that there are intellectuals, and there are intellectuals.

When someone makes an assertion of a new discovery of evidence, it is *helpful* (not IMO necessary, but then I don't make any rules here) if one supplies information about the discovery. People like to look at the original sources.

When someone draws an inference, or a series of inferences, it is *helpful* (again not IMO necessary, but then I don't make any rules here) if one describes the logical steps. People like to be able to check reasoning.

Where things start getting prickly is where:

(1) someone asserts a discovery, but can't demonstrate that the evidence actually exists;
(2) someone describes reasoning that is demonstrably flawed, such as post hoc fallacies or non sequiturs;
(3) someone responds to a polite challenge about information with an ad hominem attack, or concludes that a polite challenge about an assertion is an ad hominem attack; or
(4) someone asserts that their credentials give them some special expertise, but does not provide information regarding the credentials on which they rely.

I haven't seen much evidence of people asking questions in good faith being ripped to shreds. OTOH, I haven't been looking for same.

M_M~
Not qualified to think anything about anything

 

[Master_Margarita]

Very good, except you left out the part about Moscow being the third Rome.

M_M~

Come on now Baba, I think you're pushing this zom.....

Oh my God! Oh my God!!!

Dummett!! Dummett!!! Italy 1500s!!!! AHHHHHHHH!!!!!!

AHHHHHHHHH!!!!!

The tarot is obviously based on the secret gnostic knowledge of the marriage of Jesus to Mary Magdalene (MM). The twin towers on the misnamed "Moon" card actually represent Jesus and MM:
"the "magdal- eder"--the "tower (stronghold) of the flock" from the prophetic passage in the Hebrew Bible --Micah 4:8-10. Since "Magdala" means "tower" in Hebrew, this passage is powerfully prophetic of the role of Mary Magdalene as the "daughter of Sion" in her role as "Bride."

"The "castle" (cit a d el) emblem originally represented the city of Jerusalem--her walls, gate, ramparts and twin towers."

http://www.magdalene.org/twintowers.phphttp://www.magdalene.org/twintowers.php

Twins, as shown in the constellation Gemini, are also connected to Pisces.
http://embryology.med.unsw.edu.au/Defect/images/Smellie_twins.jpg
http://www.ianridpath.com/startales/image/gemini.JPG
http://www.pisces.com/files/piscesfish.jpg

Fish swim in water, water is shown on the "Moon" card.
http://www.tarot.org.il/Payen/18 La Lvne.png

Water has historically been connected to Atlantis. Plato mentions Atlantis.
http://www.goldenageproject.org.uk/platoillustration.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plato
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosopher

Plato flourished at the same time as Pluto.
http://www.authorama.com/remarks-b-62.html

Plato and Pluto are both Greek
http://www.greektexts.com/library/Plato/cratylus/eng/1256.html

Plato/Pluto is the name of not only an ancient philosopher, but also one of the most famous "Disney" characters.

Who is the most beloved of the Disney characters? None other than Mickey Mouse. MM! Mickey Mouse = Mary Magdalene. Pluto, (obviously slightly reinterpreted for modern eyes), is none other than Jesus himself. Pluto was Mickey's "beloved companion". Mary Magdalene was Jesus' "beloved companion". The two together represent the two towers on the "Moon" card. It's really that simple.

Please cite my work when mentioning:
Jesus
Mary Magdalene
Mickey Mouse
Pluto
Plato
Water
Atlantis
Greeks
Cards
Fish
Gemini
Pisces
Constellations
Castles
The Bible
or Tarot

 

[Debra]

Oh Umbrae! Sorry!

As I once said (and was loudly flamed for such an insinuation), the world of Tarot is filled with sloppy scholars.

Umbrae, honey, that was me! And I didn't mean to flame you, loudly or quietly.

What I meant by disputing your use of the term "scholars" was simply that anyone whose ideas are "sloppy" should not be called a "scholar" in the first place! Purely semantic. I am sorry if you felt a tongue of fire at your feet!

I should have been clearer.

I was thinking that someone has "pretensions to scholarship" or is a "scholar wanna-be" or "poseur"--because without doing good work, and without credentials establishing that one IS a scholar, someone who does crappy work is simply um er, what's a word that rhymes with "full hitter" but isn't that?

Like someone who pretends to read tarot but doesn't know a thing about it and doesn't care to put the work in--I wouldn't say that person was a "sloppy tarotist" but rather a "fake tarot reader" or simply a fraud.

Sorry again m'dear for offending--not my intention. Should we ever meet, I owe you a fire-water.

 

[Debra]

PLAGIARISM, "GIVING CREDIT" and DON'T BE AFRAID TO POST!

I have been assessing academic papers of various sorts for a long time, including extensive work with Masters theses. From this experience I have a pretty good sense of the norms of citation.

DECENCY requires that if, in conversation or correspondence, someone points to an important connection or passes on important info, you mention that fact if you remember it.

That's DECENCY--nothing to do with plagiarism. You see it at work in academic and popular writing, with thanks in a book preface for those who shared ideas. It's not required, but it's nice and it's the honorable thing to do.

To steal an IDEA the idea must be developed--not just a thought snippet.

If an idea is developed, the source of that idea should be cited in as clear a fashion as possible.

However, if the idea is not developed--if it is incoherent, rambling, vague--someone points "over there"--then no citation is needed.

The IDEA behind citation is that if the reader went to the source, they would LEARN something. If the source provides no actual information relevant to the matter at hand, then no citation is needed.

For this reason, a 250 page bibiliography is worthless. It doesn't tell the reader where they would LEARN SOMETHING about the topic at hand--it simply tells the reader the names of many articles and books. A good bibliography is SELECTIVE for material that is actually RELEVANT.

Ick. Is school out yet?

I want to say something about "fear of posting" in this forum.

I was worried about seeming stupid when I posted questions here and my own ideas on the Vieville tarot.

I got nothing but kindness and support from others here--they encouraged me at every turn and when what I wrote was ridiculous, the corrections were always done gently and with good humor. I can't think of a better illustration of the kind of bookshop I'd like to have--one with you all here, and good coffee, too.