How does the tarot speak to you?

[Fianic]

A thought came to me just how when I read tarot_red's thread on "a real moral dilemma".

Does the tarot display cards according to how the reader personally interprets those cards or do you think they just say it in their own language that it believes is universal, and that it's our job to learn that language?

tarot_red got her 3 card yes/no prediction wrong because all three cards were reversed and so she interpreted it as a "no". But when the results came it turned out to be a "yes".

On the other hand I don't read reversed cards so I just read them as upright so to me her cards meant "yes".

But in my experience, there are some cases where the tarot does speak to the individual reader personally yet at other times it seems to use a "universal language".

Allow me to elaborate. To a certain degree there must are universal meanings or else our "Your Readings" forum can't work. You may not understand your own reading, yet other readers somehow get it. At the end of the day, the cards are still the same cards regardless of personal interpretations. I've sometimes looked at other people's readings and just "knew" what the cards were trying to say, even if the first reader doesn't.

However there are times when I have done reading exchanges where readers have done good readings that were very accurate, yet when I look at the cards my thought is "how the HELL did she get that interpretation from THOSE cards?".

What are your thoughts? Does the tarot cater to the individual reader's interpretations or simply uses its universal meanings? Both arguments seem plausible yet they contradict each other in many ways.

 

[tarotbear]

My cards speak to me in a bad French accent falling somewhere between Mauruce Chevalier and the 'Nasonex' bee.

Does the tarot display cards according to how the reader personally interprets those cards or do you think they just say it in their own language that it believes is universal, and that it's our job to learn that language?

Tarot is symbology-based. In theory, a reader could leave an electromagnetic residue on the cards, which in turn come to the top of the pack when shuffling and appear in the reading, answering the question. This could support the first part of your question. However, Tarot is not about the reader, it is about the question asked by the Querent. Since Tarot is almost entirely subjective - six readers will interpret the same three cards six different ways (as evidenced on AT!), so IMHO it is not a question of 'our language/ their language' but the interpretation of symbols. On AT we see many people saying the X deck is the best they have ever used and will use no other, and the next post another person says the X deck is dreck and cannot be interpreted by them. So, it is not as much about 'learning their language' (or we could all read with the same deck) as it is about taking symbols and turning them into a cognitive or concrete reality.

 

[Zephyros]

Tarot is always right (except when it's wrong).

Tarot always speaks to us clearly so that we can understand (except when it doesn't).

What do you think is the answer?

 

[Fianic]

However, Tarot is not about the reader, it is about the question asked by the Querent. Since Tarot is almost entirely subjective - six readers will interpret the same three cards six different ways (as evidenced on AT!), so IMHO it is not a question of 'our language/ their language' but the interpretation of symbols. On AT we see many people saying the X deck is the best they have ever used and will use no other, and the next post another person says the X deck is dreck and cannot be interpreted by them. So, it is not as much about 'learning their language' (or we could all read with the same deck) as it is about taking symbols and turning them into a cognitive or concrete reality.

Yet at the same time, one reader can look at a reading done by someone else, yet still give the more accurate interpretation. It's more this part of the question which makes this more puzzling. IS the tarot entirley subjective?

Perhaps I didn't explain that clearly, but I think that's the point I'm getting at.

 

[Zephyros]

Yet at the same time, one reader can look at a reading done by someone else, yet still give the more accurate interpretation. It's more this part of the question which makes this more puzzling. IS the tarot entirley subjective?

Perhaps I didn't explain that clearly, but I think that's the point I'm getting at.

I don't think anyone can tell you the answer to that, or many other questions about Tarot. In a sense, we "create" it every time we think about it, much less do a reading. As tarotbear said, Tarot is completely subjective, because it is an article of faith, not science. Even religions have more to base on than Tarot, which has no canon. The reason I asked what you thought the answer was, is that any answer you receive, will be an answer, but not the answer and certainly not your answer. This goes for any question regarding Tarot divination.

 

[Carla]

I don't think there is an answer to your question because essentially it's asking how tarot works, and there is no definitive answer to that. I, too, read 'A real moral dilemma' as a positive outcome, because like you I don't read reversals and my first thought when she had 3 cards reversed was that she was holding the deck upside down. None of the cards were ill-dignified, either, an even stronger suggestion to interpret them in the positive, for me.

I think one reason we can't see our own readings clearly is because we are too close to the subject sometimes. It muddles things up. An objective reader can sometimes see things more clearly.

I also think reading with the intuition is best while overthinking can lead to confusion. That doesn't mean to leave out book meaning, or to follow just book meanings. I mean, when your intuition tells you (and it's often a very tiny voice indeed) what the card means, go with it. Sometimes it straight LWB, sometimes you think, hmm, why did I think the card means THAT! You're right, there ARE times when the cards speak to the reader personally, where a wonderfully accurate reading emerges and the rest of can only marvel (or puzzle) over how the reader came up with their interpretation. Willow Fox's readings do that to me very often. Then there are readings that all of us can see and pipe in to say the same thing. This is probably not something that can be explained, but just should be accepted as one of the many mysteries and joys of tarot.

 

[SunChariot]

A thought came to me just how when I read tarot_red's thread on "a real moral dilemma".

Does the tarot display cards according to how the reader personally interprets those cards or do you think they just say it in their own language that it believes is universal, and that it's our job to learn that language?

tarot_red got her 3 card yes/no prediction wrong because all three cards were reversed and so she interpreted it as a "no". But when the results came it turned out to be a "yes".

On the other hand I don't read reversed cards so I just read them as upright so to me her cards meant "yes".

But in my experience, there are some cases where the tarot does speak to the individual reader personally yet at other times it seems to use a "universal language".

Allow me to elaborate. To a certain degree there must are universal meanings or else our "Your Readings" forum can't work. You may not understand your own reading, yet other readers somehow get it. At the end of the day, the cards are still the same cards regardless of personal interpretations. I've sometimes looked at other people's readings and just "knew" what the cards were trying to say, even if the first reader doesn't.

However there are times when I have done reading exchanges where readers have done good readings that were very accurate, yet when I look at the cards my thought is "how the HELL did she get that interpretation from THOSE cards?".

What are your thoughts? Does the tarot cater to the individual reader's interpretations or simply uses its universal meanings? Both arguments seem plausible yet they contradict each other in many ways.

My personal beliefs are that tarot_red did not get the answer wrong. The future can change, so what I believe happened is that the future the cards predicted actually was the future the querent was heading towards at the exact moment in time the reading was done, but afterwards that future changed.

That being said, yes it is also my belief that the cards speak to each of us differently. EG if a reversed card may mean NO to her, but it may not to another reader. The powers that be that send us the answers vis the cards know how each of us thinks and sends us the answers in the way makes sense to us in the system we have chosen to use. EG if the answer was meant to be "no", while she might get a reversed card to tell her that, someone else who reads differently would get that same message differently in the way that they would understand it most clearly.

I believe it is a combination of us learning to understand the way that source talks to use personally as we adapt to that and know what it is saying AND to that source understanding how we think and working with us and sending us the answers in the way we as individuals think. We all have different personalities and think differntly. What means one thing to one person will not mean the same to another.

To me, that is what it is. We learn to understand how our cards talk to us, like a child a bit with repetition. You tell a baby over and over that a nose is their noes and they get it. We get the same card over and over telling us the same thing and we get it that that is what it means to us, indiviudualliy. And there is also some of the universe working with us. And knowing how we think and sending answers in the way we pesronally will get them. EG if you want to send and answer about unconditional love and loyatly, one reader may get a card image with a dog on it. That is my meaning. But a reader who is terrified of dogs will never see that meaning there. The source that sends us the answers is wise enough not to send that image if that is the message it is trying to get across. It will send another card instead.

And even for the set meanings we all have different meanings. Never mind for the intutiive part and the imagery.

My belief is that the reader and the source that sends the answers mutually develop a unique language as the reader learns to read. And it grows over time.

My belief, and I know many will likely disagree, is that no one but the original reader can ever understand what the original message was meant to be. Because the reader and the universe have developed together a unique language (or a dialest if you will) that they alone know how to speak. And that means to me that the Your Readings section serves no purpose. And that is why you never see me posting my readings there.

Sure you can ask about what a card can potentially mean in different situations outside of a reading and that can be useful and educational. But my belief is that once the reading is done, no one but the original reader can know what it means. SO no other opinions are really valid. If someone else sees something the original reader did not, then that was nto meant to be part of the answer.

It is as if the reading was done in Chinese and the second reader is thinking in Russian. They do not speak the original language that the reading was done in, so they cannot possibly know.

Those are my personal views on that.

Babs

 

[Kiata]

Very interesting threat, Fianic.

Your question is something I pondered on a bit myself and it made me think, Tarot must have a property similar to what they call wave–particle duality. I read this paradox to be described as a fundamental property of the Universe.
I like that idea

 

[Masa]

I see it as entirely nonmystical and utterly subjective. Also delightful, surprising, and darn useful!

It works because the cards depict universal archetypes that all humans experience, and all the cards have dozens of possible meanings, so you can always find some way (usually many ways) to make it apply to yourself and your situation. It's the same way fake psychics work; you start with some something general, then you zoom in and get more specific as you acquire more information.

This essay, which has nothing to do with tarot, is nevertheless my major touchstone in thinking about why the cards are always able to tell me useful things, and why I usually fail to see the many many totally useless and inaccurate possible readings:
http://www.snopes.com/history/american/lincoln-kennedy.asp

None of this means that tarot is bad or pointless, of course. I have major mental and emotional breakthroughs all the time using this kind of guided brainstorming--it's an incredible tool for that. And it's not without its spiritual wonderment for me, either. It's just that instead of admiring the energy of the cards themselves, I'm frequently in awe of the fact that our brains are so good at creating, interpreting, and synthesizing symbolism. Humans are awesome. <3

I know this is not how everyone experiences tarot. Other people experience it WILDLY differently, and that's okay. ^_^ But as for me, this is how tarot speaks.

 

[Chiriku]

It works because the cards depict universal archetypes that all humans experience, and all the cards have dozens of possible meanings, so you can always find some way (usually many ways) to make it apply to yourself and your situation.

None of this means that tarot is bad or pointless, of course. I have major mental and emotional breakthroughs all the time using this kind of guided brainstorming--it's an incredible tool for that. And it's not without its spiritual wonderment for me, either. It's just that instead of admiring the energy of the cards themselves, I'm frequently in awe of the fact that our brains are so good at creating, interpreting, and synthesizing symbolism.

What Masa said.