Tarot elements and seasons

Eco74

fall_guy said:
King = Fire (and therefore Spring)
Queen = Water = Summer
Knight = Air = Winter
Page = Earth = Autumn

The Queen and Page seem appropriate, but I think swapping the King and Knight around seems more natural:

King = Air = Winter (i.e coldness, intellect)
Knight = Fire = Spring (i.e heat, passion/enterprise)
I agree with you on this.
The order I've figured is;
Page - Earth - Static, slowmoving and where seeds begin to grow.
Knight - Fire - Action, moving, quick to respond and eager to move, action with little thought.
Queen - Water - Again static, desire tempered with adaptation.
King - Air - Freeflowing and allencompassing, run by thought, experience and knowledge.
 

Fulgour

I was just thinking...

and it occurred to me... Why go by the "symbols"
which are "physical" rather than their significance?

Wands - Fire - ENTHUSIASM
Cups - Water - INTUITION
Swords - Air - MENTAL ABILITY
Pentacles - Earth - PRACTICAL STABILITY

:) Maybe something there...
 

Sophie

Eco74 said:
Queen - Water - Again static, desire tempered with adaptation.
Sorry Eco - but healthy water is absoluely not static! When it is it becomes - stagnant. A very smelly queen indeed that would be.

Queens stay adaptable because they know how to flow....sometimes slow, sometimes fast.
 

Flidais

dantarot said:
...I came across this new book called The Way of Four, which analyzes the four elements both historically and cross-culturally.
DanTarot, please let us know what you think of this book. My hand has started to pluck it off the shelf in more than one bookstore! :)
 

Eco74

Helvetica said:
Sorry Eco - but healthy water is absoluely not static! When it is it becomes - stagnant. A very smelly queen indeed that would be.

Queens stay adaptable because they know how to flow....sometimes slow, sometimes fast.
*whacks self on head*
As a total water-person I really should have kept that in mind.. *ugh*

You're right ofcourse. Even when it looks quiet and still, there is a lot of motion underneath the surface.
I stick to the 'desire tempered with adaptation' though. ;)
 

Aura Wolf

This whole thing is just...shocking me. I was thinking of posting a thread about this just yesterday! I am fine with the traditional associations as dantarot posted them, except I was recently having trouble with the Fire/Summer and Water/Autumn associations, thinking they should be switched. I can see Fire and Summer, and I can see almost all of the other combinations, but for some reason I have trouble seeing Water as Autumn. When I think of Autumn I think cool and dry, not wet, and I think bright colours like red and yellow leaves, which reminds me of Fire much more than Water. When I think of Summer I think of swimming, so I think of Water.

Does anyone have anymore info on this association, as per why we associate water with Autumn? The info I've found so far does not really convince me.

Not only that, I HAVE "The Way of Four"--it is an excellent book! It is packed with info, all sorts of associations--it has really helped me understand the elements more and was a very interesting experience. It is a workbook, so there are tons of quizzes for you to take--which I find so fun :) These along with the info it gives helps you understand what type of personality you are--I am a Water personality even though I am an Earth sign...helps you recognize other people's elemental personalities by the clothes they wear, the way they act, and how they decorate their homes--really interesting and really helps to understand human nature. It also shows you how to incorporate the elements into your home and work environments, and it has great nature exercises for each element, meditations, and info about using the elements in magic. Even has information on elemental beauty treatments, perfumes, foods, rituals, music, herbs & flowers, gems & stones, and a lot more....and I really enjoyed all the history about how different cultures view the elements and how they have evolved over time. Highly recommended! (Sorry for the book review! :D)

I didn't even think to look in here actually; but since it's on-topic I'll post what Deborah Lipp wrote in the book about the seasons. The way she parallels them to the times of day and directions helps:

Fire: "Fire resides in the South. It is associated with noon, the hottest and brightest time of day, and with summer, the hottest and brightest time of year."

Water: "Water's direction is West. Sunset in the west is also associated with death, with the end of things, and with transformation. Twilight is an in-between and mysterious time, and so is autumn."

Earth: "Earth is located in the North and is associated with midnight, because North is opposite the noon of South and because subterranean places are dark. Winter is in the North--the coldness of midnight, the coldness of deep soil, and the stillness and silence of waiting for spring."

Air: "The direction of Air is East, and since the Sun rises in the east, Air is associated with the morning, with the spring (the beginning of the agricultural and astrological year), and with beginnings of all kinds."


Of course those are her interpretations, and I think everyone associates things differently--but it does help clear things up a little, at least for THESE associations. And it is easy to see how these correspond to tarot...
 

Flidais

Star Spirit said:
Not only that, I HAVE "The Way of Four"--it is an excellent book! It is packed with info, all sorts of associations-- Highly recommended!
Now where did I put that credit card... ??? :D
 

mythos

I'd put the elements and the four seasons in the too hard basket given that most of the material written applies to the Northern Hemisphere, and my brain hurt trying to reverse them (sound silly, but it is related to a learning disability I have). But, how could I miss the idea of making attributions that a personal to the individual? This kind of flexibility is usually my forte. So thank you all ... now this comes out of the too hard basket, and is placed firmly in the new adventure in learning basket.

For example, on a purely geographical basis, as a person who lives on the south-east coast of Australia, water is east, and earth is west, fire is north, because it is soooo hot up north in Queensland in the summer, leaving air as south ... and cold, the place from which the bitterest winds blow in winter. Given the conflictual element in swords and tarot is feels right, particularly if you describe those cold winds as 'cutting'. But what about hot air rising? ... on a weather basis, water is spring (spring rains), but for someone who lives in the more tropical zones, water would be summer because it is the wet season. What fun this is.

Whether I'll ever find an answer 'just for me' is a whole other issue, but if one adds the idea that the elements of air, water and fire mix to create earth, maybe flexibility and a reminder to Self not to get caught up in concrete definition-making is the most important 'element' of all. Thank you all,

mythos:)