Thoth Tarot and a Magical Career

[thorhammer]

How do people who belong to O.T.O. or Thelema for example use the Thoth Tarot?
Is it used as a reading deck?
Is it used as a visual text?
Is it used as a meditative device?
Is it copied as in drawn or painted for a personal deck Like B.O.T.A?
Is there some sort of ritual associated with it?
What makes the deck Magical in the use of it?
Is it a visual example of Grades and steps? (not sure I have said that correctly)

 

[ravenest]

Because I have been asked, and I do not know the answer, for those who have asked - maybe this thread will get you an answer.
I request that if you post, please play nice. It makes me very nervous to post in this forum- but as far as Tarot is concerned it is worth the risk.



How do people who belong to O.T.O. or Thelema for example use the Thoth Tarot?

IN A MULTITUDE OF WAYS, SOME HAVE BEEN OUTLINED IN VARIOUS POSTS IN VARIOUS PLACES ON THE FORUM.

Is it used as a reading deck?

I DO, BUT THAT IS IT'S LEAST VALUE, IT IS A BOOK OF VERY RELEVENT MAGICAL INFORMATIUON AND RELATIONSHIPS ON MANY LEVELS OFFERING ADVISE ON HOW TO DEAL WITH MANY SITUATIONS AND EXPERIENCES,

Is it used as a visual text?

IT CAN BE

Is it used as a meditative device?

MOST DEFINATLY

Is it copied as in drawn or painted for a personal deck Like B.O.T.A?

SOMETIMES

Is there some sort of ritual associated with it?

YES

What makes the deck Magical in the use of it?

NOT SURE I UNDERSTAND THE QUESTION, DO YOU MEAN THE RITUAL RECCOMMENDED TO GO WITH THE READING OF THE CARDS?

Is it a visual example of Grades and steps? (not sure I have said that correctly)

NOT SURE WHAT YOU MEAN BY 'VISUAL EXAMPLE' THE OTO HAS THREE GRADES; THE MAN OF EARTH, THE LOVERS AND THE HERMIT. TWO HAVE AN OBVIOUS CONNECTION. 'STEPS' IN OTO MEAN A FORM OF RECOGNITION, PERHAPS YOU MEAN DEGREES?

These are just a few of the questions raised to me (the totally wrong person my friends!) and maybe there are more 'right questions' but I think most will get my meaning and query. I am not a member of any group or society. Nor is this query a prurient peep for gossip about such groups- nor a discussion on the members or leaders and their worth (this is a really important thing to take note of) - just a wish for information.



IN THE LATEST LIBER ABA BOOK IV - MAGICK IN THEORY AND PRACTICE, THERE IS AN OUTLINED CURRICULUM OF THE STUDY OF THE OTO. THAT MIGHT HELP.

THERE IS NO DIRECT TEACHING IN OTO (WHICH EXISTS ONLY IN THE DEGREE INITIATION TEMPLES AND THE GNOSTIC MASS TEMPLE) RELATING TO THOTH TAROT AND IT'S USES, MOST OF THE ABOVE WOULD BE VIA THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE LOCAL OTO GROUP, THEY ARE FAIRLY INDEPENDANT AND FOLLOW THEIR OWN PATHS (ASIDE FROM THE ABOVE MENTIONED TEACHINGS) AND METHODS.

SOME MAY NOT EVEN READ TAROT AT ALL!

SORRY I AM TOO SLACK TO DO THE QUOTEY THING PROPERLY ... TIME RESTRAINTS.

STILL NERVOUS?

 

[Rosanne]

( Nervous?) Nah Ravenest- thanks for the information.
~Rosanne

Oops read the answer properly Rosanne I mean degrees- Yes!
and the the ritual that goes with reading the cards- yes! I hope those reading this will go get that latest writing from Liber Aba Book 1V if they can.

 

[Rosanne]

Is there some sort of ritual associated with it?

YES

What makes the deck Magical in the use of it?

NOT SURE I UNDERSTAND THE QUESTION, DO YOU MEAN THE RITUAL RECCOMMENDED TO GO WITH THE READING OF THE CARDS?

Is there anywhere- aside from joining one of these groups, one can read about this ritual recommended to go with reading the cards? Is there any books written about the magical ritual of such groups?

IN THE LATEST LIBER ABA BOOK IV - MAGICK IN THEORY AND PRACTICE, THERE IS AN OUTLINED CURRICULUM OF THE STUDY OF THE OTO. THAT MIGHT HELP.

Does one write to O.T.O. to acquire this book 1V?

~Rosanne

 

[sapienza]

Really interesting questions Rosanne, I'm also curious. Reading the thread on 'how to appreciate Crowley' has left me feeling rather uneducated in all things to do with the Thoth deck.

 

[Grigori]

Is there anywhere- aside from joining one of these groups, one can read about this ritual recommended to go with reading the cards? Is there any books written about the magical ritual of such groups?

I think Ravenest was referring to the Opening of the Key reading technique, which is a GD method. Crowley outlines it in the Book of Thoth. I'd be interested to hear about other publications detailing rituals based on the deck. I know a lot of Crowley's rituals are based on Vision and the Voice, his efforts as scrying the Enochian Aethyrs, and I think a number of the cards ar based on the same visions. That would be really interesting to learn more about.

Does one write to O.T.O. to acquire this book 1V?

Its a retail book, you can get it in many stores (even Borders and such often have it) http://www.amazon.com/Magick-Liber-...bs_sr_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1223442523&sr=8-2 This is the new edition which has a lot of supplementary information which is useful. Its Crowley's Magnum Opus on Magick, and quite a hefty read

 

[Rosanne]

Thanks Similia that clears that up- I thought it might be different to the Book of Thoth. Not sure I can wade through another read of even an updated Opus on Magic- but others might

Now is the opportunity for those who asked me questions I am not qualified to answer regarding magical groups etc to ask here. See- there are reasonable, approachable people who will answer factually. Great.
~Rosanne

 

[Grigori]

Thanks Similia that clears that up- I thought it might be different to the Book of Thoth. Not sure I can wade through another read of even an updated Opus on Magic- but others might

It is actually a really interesting read, though I admit to having skipped large sections (though others I have read repeatedly). It is a bit bigger than the phone book after all, with smallish print.

When I first bought it, I opened to the section on the Wand, expecting a "how to make" guide for ritual implements. Instead I got the best thing Crowley ever published on the suit of Wands, though he wasn't discussing tarot at all. But if your key interest is the tarot (as I know yours is) then it's not the book for you.

I reponse to your initial question, I'm not a member of the OTO, or a Thelemite, however I appreciate and am interested in their philosophy. I use the Thoth tarot for readings primarily, secondarily as a meditation tool, or bedside table decoration if there is something I want to keep fresh in my mind. Occasionally I use individual cards ritually as talismans.

Oh, and very occasionally as a card game

 

[Aeon418]

Is it used as a reading deck?

Yes. But not only for the purpose of obtaining answers to questions. It is also an excellent tool for the development of intuition.

In Crowley's other iniatory structure, the A.'.A.'., divination was placed on the path of Qoph.

Is it used as a visual text?

Yes. Crowley himself refers to the Thoth tarot as a series of illustrations to The Book of the Law.

Is it used as a meditative device?

Yes. It can, and is, used for meditation. Not only that it is used as a tool for clairvoyance or skrying. This is based in the idea that each of the trumps is a visual representation of an aspect of your own consciousness. Using the specific imagery of the cards to induce a vision is a way of revealing yourself to yourself.

Is it copied as in drawn or painted for a personal deck Like B.O.T.A?

I have seen B&W versions of the Thoth that were intended to used in that way.

Is there some sort of ritual associated with it?

Not that I'm aware of. I suppose you could describe the Opening of the Key spread as ritualistic.

Some people like to perform a banishing and a short invocation ritual before reading though.

What makes the deck Magical in the use of it?

I don't understand the question. Could you clarify or expand upon it?

Is it a visual example of Grades and steps? (not sure I have said that correctly)

Yes. This is from the A.'.A.'. system. Notice how the paths of initiation, and the individual steps taken, directly relate to Tarot.
http://www.hermetic.com/crowley/images/large-abiegnus.jpg

 

[thorhammer]

*raises hand*

Now is the opportunity for those who asked me questions I am not qualified to answer regarding magical groups etc to ask here. See- there are reasonable, approachable people who will answer factually. Great.
~Rosanne

It was me Thankyou, Rosanne, for starting this thread.

I approached Rosanne because we've had a few PM exchanges in the past and I find her very friendly and approachable.

My question was inspired by a couple of things - notably the heated conversation in the Appreciating Crowley thread, but also a burgeoning interest in studying the Crowley/Harris Thoth. I am possibly a bit more interested than Rosanne in delving into the depths of magical theory contained in, and implied by, the deck.

BUT

I have noted what I perceive to be a dearth of deep technical discussion in the Thoth Study Group forum, and that makes me wonder - is there a reason for this lack? Because I know there are a few people on AT who use the deck very seriously, and not just for readings, but as part of the whole worldview inherent in Crowley's work. It made me wonder why these people don't share their wisdom. I want to learn about the complexities of the deck, but having explored this forum, I keep hitting this black glass wall that deftly deflects attention deeper into the maze of mirrors which leads . . . out. Nowhere.

There are some really fantastic posts in this forum, which have highlighted to me the depths possible. I'd really like to see some more open discussion of this topic, where people like myself (and if I may, sapienza? ) may begin to learn more about the deck.

And if such discussion is not *allowed*, then I'd appreciate someone telling me that.

\m/ Kat

PS. Thanks again, Rosanne