Magic Circles - study group?

earthair

Tanga said:
Well - there's that hole... and the demons...

lol

But it's not really a hole, it's energy moving much faster and ever faster from the event horizon to the singularity or focus. The moment before a torus collapses happens to also be the astrological sign for the Sun.

I don't worry about demons- but I do worry about accidentally creating a black hole

[This is probably why all the old grimoires caution against black magic :joke:

]

Which begs the question, if humans are a torus energy field and we cast another torus/circle around us, which directions multiply energy and which work against each other?

Found this diagram to hopefully answer ravenest's question. The point where people cast a circle around the 'edge' is only part of what is happening. Even the act of casting simple circles creates the beginnings of a vortex. The only way to avoid it would be to simultaneously cast the entire circle in one complete throw?

Tanga

earthair said:
lol

But it's not really a hole, it's energy moving much faster and ever faster from the event horizon to the singularity or focus. The moment before a torus collapses happens to also be the astrological sign for the Sun.

BURN BABY!

earthair said:
but I do worry about accidentally creating a black hole

Seriously?

earthair said:
[This is probably why all the old grimoires caution against black magic ]

What? and not the insanity, possession and possible resultant psycho behaviour? :joke:

(A favourite novel series comes to mind: Castor Felix series by Mike Carey. Where his best friend is in co-habitance with a demon inside him. The result of a botched summoning followed by a banishing-gone-wrong by Castor himself. It's a great story.

).

earthair

Tanga said:
BURN BABY!

Seriously?

What? and not the insanity, possession and possible resultant psycho behaviour?

Well not seriously seriously, it was a joke about what Stephen Hawking said ("The Higgs potential has the worrisome feature that it might become metastable at energies above 100 [billion] gigaelectronvolts (GeV). This could mean that the universe could undergo catastrophic vacuum decay, with a bubble of the true vacuum expanding at the speed of light. This could happen at any time and we wouldn't see it coming.")

Here's the mother of all magic circles where they invoked Higgs boson

ravenest

Tanga said:
I'll be wanting my torus to collapse into a sphere asap.

Well - there's that hole... and the demons...

Oh - I see. Torus better understood.
Well I do hope that we will "discover a natural pattern, and develop a plan to co-operate with this design"
Plus "All Hail" to Sensei Morihei Ueshiba, whose form I studied for a tiny little while - and to the tensegrity of the universe *raises glass* (of cranberry juice ).

Ueshiba Sama declares ; I do not turn .... I remain still and turn the whole Universe around me.

The Ueshibacentric Universe. It certainly sets up a mental attitude of 'stability'

ravenest

earthair said:
But circles, spheres, vortexes, discs, tori ...are all different expressions of the possibilities and development of the same force. I don't understand where I lost you?

cause I thought we were talking about simple circle casting , as a preliminary to ritual, not ritual itself .

Eg " Let him break into the dance, tracing a centripetal spiral widdershins, enriched by revolutions upon his axis as he passeth each Quarter, until he come to the centre of the Circle. "

http://hermetic.com/crowley/libers/lib5.html

but this is AFTER the circle is formed , and it is more of an 'open circle', elements are drawn in to the centre for balance and neutralization. If we are talking about 'ritual' itself ... sure .... make an inverted obelix if you want

earthair said:
I was just musing that magic circles are humans tapping into the power of the way circles behave and their unique properties.
I think when most people cast a circle it's actually a torus, and a spindle torus has vortexes at the point it disintegrates into a sphere. Unless a person deliberately tries to cast a flattened torus.

I dispute that with thee !

lets post a poll ;

When you cast a circle are you making a circle around you

or

when you cast a circle it's actually a torus, and a spindle torus with vortexes at the point it disintegrates into a sphere. Unless you are deliberately tring to cast a flattened torus.

earthair said:
Why would magicians not want to harness that?

Too fantastic ? I mean , lets conjure up demons .... but a toroidal circle

... get outa here !

If you are doing this its more of a 'fountain technique' practice and not a circle casting - as is generally understood.

earthair said:
The dolphin video is wonderful.

a novel way to 'cast' a circle

ravenest

earthair said:
lol

But it's not really a hole, it's energy moving much faster and ever faster from the event horizon to the singularity or focus. The moment before a torus collapses happens to also be the astrological sign for the Sun.

I don't worry about demons- but I do worry about accidentally creating a black hole [This is probably why all the old grimoires caution against black magic ]

Which begs the question, if humans are a torus energy field and we cast another torus/circle around us, which directions multiply energy and which work against each other?

Found this diagram to hopefully answer ravenest's question. The point where people cast a circle around the 'edge' is only part of what is happening. Even the act of casting simple circles creates the beginnings of a vortex. The only way to avoid it would be to simultaneously cast the entire circle in one complete throw?

Well, a magician is only limited by their imagination I suppose .

I could show you similar moving where it all comes together and may answer the question you beg , but it is in a video and I am banned from proving or demonstrating my points via video on this site . Try stuff on 'fountain technique' , that might throw up some moving images and energy graphs . If you really want to see it (and cant find 'fountain technique' ) , PM me and we do it via that.

ravenest

Tanga said:
BURN BABY!

Seriously?

What? and not the insanity, possession and possible resultant psycho behaviour?
(A favourite novel series comes to mind: Castor Felix series by Mike Carey. Where his best friend is in co-habitance with a demon inside him. The result of a botched summoning followed by a banishing-gone-wrong by Castor himself. It's a great story. ).

Running a magical group for many years ( and being part of a regulating national body for 'magical schools' ) I have seen such things. One student was recommended, as they all where. to start here and follow this step next and then .... she asked for access to our library (which came with membership ). I indicated the relevant books on beginnings, banishings, stabilizing, balance and preliminary exercises.

Later I realised they were all still on the shelf .... but a book on demonic evocation was gone ( that she did not enter in the borrowers register as well

) .... six months later she was arrested abusing and attacking telegraph poles as they were actually these towers that ......

and had a little enforced visit inside the local ' holiday and rest center ' .

(As my Iranian boss used to complain to his staff ; "They NEVER listen me ! WHY you never listen me ? ... now everything go wrong ! "

ravenest

earthair said:
Well not seriously seriously, it was a joke about what Stephen Hawking said ("The Higgs potential has the worrisome feature that it might become metastable at energies above 100 [billion] gigaelectronvolts (GeV). This could mean that the universe could undergo catastrophic vacuum decay, with a bubble of the true vacuum expanding at the speed of light. This could happen at any time and we wouldn't see it coming.")

Here's the mother of all magic circles where they invoked Higgs boson

Sorry, thats a ritual using a circle , not a magic circle as such .

Also, Hawking was wrong ... just as wrong as those people that thought we would explode or something if we went fast on a train.

You are convulting modern science with old remnant hermetic science ( magical circle casting )

they just dont mix (although many try to make out they do - yes, I am well aware of modern pop / magical writers that declare they do ) see my posts here :

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?p=4624829#post4624829

Tanga

ravenest said:
...Running a magical group for many years ( and being part of a regulating national body for 'magical schools' ) I have seen such things..."

*that's why it's such a great story*.
Yeah - and I know people who can relate the same things with people they know.
(plus - from disciplines other than the Western Traditions).
One individual never recovered and is permanently in a 'holiday and rest centre'.

ravenest said:
Sorry, that's a ritual using a circle, not a magic circle as such.

You are convulting modern science with old remnant hermetic science ( magical circle casting )

they just don't mix...

...There's a hole of sorts (she says in her simplistic view) - or at the very least a place where the border between barrier and self is skinnier - so...a torus, is not a circle for casting - as I know it.
And I'm sticking to that. :joke:

earthair

ravenest said:
Sorry, thats a ritual using a circle , not a magic circle as such .

Also, Hawking was wrong ... just as wrong as those people that thought we would explode or something if we went fast on a train.

You are convulting modern science with old remnant hermetic science ( magical circle casting )

they just dont mix (although many try to make out they do - yes, I am well aware of modern pop / magical writers that declare they do ) see my posts here :

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?p=4624829#post4624829

*coughs very loudly*

*goes off to Google wiki definition of magic circle*

*returns with tea and biscuits*

"A magic circle is circle (or sphere, field) of space marked out by practitioners of many branches of ritual magic, which they generally believe will contain energy and form a sacred space, or will provide them a form of magical protection, or both. It may be marked physically, drawn in salt or chalk, for example, or merely visualised. Its spiritual significance is similar to that of mandala and yantra[citation needed] in some Eastern religions."

LHC is a circle. It's marked out. They believe it will contain a certain energy. Calling it the God particle certainly tells us they regard it as sacred. Anyone who could harness this power would certainly be using it to protect themselves. And doesn't this look like a mandala.

Hawking was not wrong, because he also pointed out "A particle accelerator that reaches 100bn GeV would be larger than Earth, and is unlikely to be funded in the present economic climate" Phew. :joke:

Magic Circles - study group?

earthair

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