Astrological Reading Methods for Pips

[Bernice]

Good to hear from you Mel
So you've been flaunting your body on a beach - and now someone's after it.... lol!

Looking forward to your next astro-reading - I'll hang back and see what everyone else says first. And you have more number-models for us to delve into, welcome back indeed!

Wishing you well, Bee

 

[SolSionnach]

I'm looking forward to your next posting as well, Mel.
Oh, and good luck dodging the scary Japanese woman. Nice to hear that the Japanese have weirdos just like the rest of us...

 

[frelkins]

Well, while we wait for Mel, I will leap into this gap and offer a spread done today with the LS Vacchetta for a friend of mine who told me her troubles at dance class. Of course, it's a relationship question. . .Will they live together?:

Apparently this is a long-distance thing. Taking her as Q Bastones at house 1, house 7 would be 10 Spada or "end of troubles," since swords in Mel's system are negative, troubling, and 10 is the end of the Pythagorean cycle. Ace Swords is the worst card in Mel's world, so I think her answer is yes.

The only other Sword is also a Q, supporting the querent and I suppose "passing" to both querent and quesited. Q Swords is a tough cookie with the head of her enemy in her bag - that is, she has literally "bagged her man." (No I don't think this refers to Mel's scary Japanese chick! )

However, let's look at all those Bastones! These mean hard work in Mel's system so I think she will have to struggle with the situation before they move into together.

Any comments? Insights? Please advise!

 

[Bernice]

Querent = Queen Batons:

She passes to the 6th house (king Batons), and the 9th, 10th, 11th and 12th!
I'll have to have a think about this...

Quesited = 10 Swords: (Unless the quesited is the 4th House - Home?)

And as you say, only one passing, Queen Swords in his 9th.

Such a lot of Batons - I reckon she's all over the place! Back later after having a longer look.

Bee

Edit: Maybe they've got to move away to be together? Abroard?

 

[Melanchollic]

The querent has a conjunction with the quesited via the King of Batons. This is certainly a 'maybe'. This clearly shows her interest. I'm not sure what to make of his passed cards, the Queen of Swords and the 10 of Batons. The querent passes to these cards as well. Is this an indirect way of showing that they'll both 'come together'? Does it show that she is following him everywhere? Does it mean that these are mutual concerns both parties have? I'd certainly ask the querent about the issues of these two houses.

Overall, I'd say living together is a slight possibility, and would entail a good deal of effort from both parties to make it work. The exact nature of the 'effort' can't possibly be uncovered without some more consultation with the querent.

 

[Bernice]

Opps, yes both Querent & Quesited have conjunctions!

Just havimng a quick browse - gotta finish dinner - back later.

Bee

 

[frelkins]

Querent = Queen Batons:

She passes to the 6th house (king Batons), and the 9th, 10th, 11th and 12th!
I'll have to have a think about this...

Yes, so it seems to me that the 6th is about fixing or making things, as Mel has said, in work and health, etc. She is willing to be the K Bastones, here, that is, she has the motivation to Just Do It, Go For It, in a guy-type way.

The 9th is about travel & philosophy, right? The card here, the 4, shows that she enjoys these "fruits" and the pruning tools in the picture shows that she is ready to harvest them. I agree with Bernice, since she said this was a long-distance thing, she is ready to move to his city. The 4 is foundation, she will move and happily set up a house there.

The 10th is about career. This is lot of heavy Bastones firmly planted in a garden (see snails & toad). Moving may affect her job, she needs to be aware of that, it will mean more work, it may retard her career. 10 is the end of the cycle, it may mean the end of her current career, she may have to switch jobs, even move to another field!

The 11th, Mel says, is friends and future, right? 3 Bastones, this won't be a problem for her, the 3 is the first result, she would successfully relocate, I think and would benefit from this "exploring the unknown," that is, I think she might actually be better off after the disruption in the 10th house. This card, i feel, encourages a move!

Finally, the 12th house, dreams & hopes, the 6 wands, yes, she dreams of the harmony & success the 6 brings.

Now for that Q Sw in her 3rd house, environment & communication - she's intellectual & determined, she will tell him her feelings in a straight-forward honest manner.

That they share the Q says to me they have good, direct, unusually honest communication between them.

"Turning the chart" makes the Q his 9th, right? So his philosophy is one of essential honesty & directness, anyway.

Onto that other passing, the 10 Bastone, we've talked about how that will affect her already. Him, it's in his 4th house, his environment. This is again, a 10, an end of whatever he has now, which being Bastones, is a lot of work. But is it good work or bad work, I don't know?

That his 1st house when we turn the chart is 10 Sw - again it seems like he's coming to the end of some things in his life and might be ready or on the brink of being ready to go a new direction?

I don't see now, however, how turning the chart reveals any insight into his feelings about living together.

conjunction with the quesited via the King of Batons

I don't understand conjunctions well enough, obviously, Mel! These are powerful and good, right? The King is a bold, assertive guy, motivated to make things GO. I think they both want this relationship. I think her prospects for moving in with him are better than you describe them, as "slight."

So please tell me where my error is. It's true I like my friend a lot, and am sympathetic to her, so if I'm over optimistic, please tell me and enlighten us all!

 

[Melanchollic]

Hi frelkins,

All good except for the 12th House. It isn't the house of hopes and dreams.

Twelfth House: self undoing, hidden enemies, suffering, difficulties, any secret matter, imprisonment, large animals, the querent's fears, the feet

Okay, Conjunctions.

Conjunction is when one of the significators, either by suit or by number, passes to a house next to the house of the other significator. When the querent's significator passes to a conjunction with that of the quesited, the querent will achieve what he or she wants, but will have to work for it (go to it). When the significator of the quesited passes into a conjunction with that of the querent, on the other hand, no effort by the querent is needed (it comes to them). When both the querent and quesited have conjunction, it is the the second most powerful indicator of relationship. The third most powerful is a single conjunction.

There's a "quick-recap" of all the different types of Indicators of Relationship on post #64 of this thread.

http://www.tarotforum.net/showpost.php?p=1553953&postcount=64



I think we are all in agreement that 'living together' is a possibility here, Yes? And I also think that we are all 'stumped' by the specifics. Of course, only the querent can fill in these blanks.


I think the best way to do one of these spreads is with the querent sitting in front of you, so you can give them a thorough drilling. At least have them on the phone or IM.

For example,

"Now for that Q Sw in her 3rd house, environment & communication - she's intellectual & determined, she will tell him her feelings in a straight-forward honest manner. "

Yep. That could definitely be a valid interpretation of the card. But the 3rd House also is the house of siblings, or students, or routines, or neighbors, or hands...

As both significators pass to the Queen of Swords, we can assume it is significant. But does it mean he is really interested in her sister? One of her students? He really just wants to move into her neighborhood? Has a disgusting hand fetish??

How do we find out?

We ask the querent. The only way we can determine what the card probably means is by eliminating all the variables of what it probably doesn't mean. I think, ideally, the querent should be doing most of the talking during a reading. If there is indeed a science to this art (or is it an art to this science?) it would surely be in finding the right questions to ask in a spread, and then eliminating the dead ends.

A confusing 'baton encrusted' spread like this one demands we break it down to the basics. Start general and only elaborate the details as far as the querent can confirm. Just like down in good ol' Texas, we should stick to the 'two-step'!


1. Find the Significators.

2. Find the Connection.


Step #2 is why we need the Occupations, Conjunctions, Mutations, and Translations.

Here are the basic guidelines to how it all fits together (which sometimes need to be disregarded all together, but usually not ).

• The type of card (suit, number, trump, court) only shows us the significators potential - the significators ability or power to act.
  
• The houses to which a significator passes then shows us some very general probabilities of the areas in which this power might manifest.
  
• It is the Indicators of Relationship however that show us, if indeed, their is an occasion to act.

Both significators may be great cards, and they both may pass to great houses, but if their aren't any Indicators of Relationship, the occasion or opportunity for something to happen, just isn't there.

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I just noticed there is a Translation in frelkin's reading as well, via the King of Coins and the King of Batons. So we can add this to our Conjunction, and the various aspecting Mutations. So we have several Indicators of Relationship here. The problem again is it is all happening via Batons and Swords, which makes me think, even though there seems to be a affirmation that they could live together, I'm not sure if they should live together.

 

[SolSionnach]

::snip:: The problem again is it is all happening via Batons and Swords, which makes me think, even though there seems to be a affirmation that they could live together, I'm not sure if they should live together.

That was my thought, after just a cursory look at the spread. I saw all those batons and thought - whoa! Talk about laboring! - but I haven't looked at this in depth just yet - will post about it tomorrow.

 

[Bernice]

Had a good look at this spread now, also read Mels post.... they've definatly got a strong connection. ("Hand fetish" - ROFL!)

I have wondered, what if the timing for this relationship is wrong? Are they (or is the querent) rushing this because of feeling pressured in some way (batons)? What if the question were asked in approx. 6 weeks time?

I think it might be a good idea if some method of Timing could be used. What about the Hot/Cold/Moist/Dry business - one of them is Fast, another Slow etc?

Bee