Christ-follower who loves Tarot.

Morwenna

I haven't had time to read this whole thread yet, but what I've read strikes many chords with me. I was raised Catholic and came to incorporate many Pagan practices into my life in mid-adulthood; I sometimes call myself a Christo-Pagan but I haven't followed those links on Christo-Paganism yet so I don't know if I'd be misrepresenting myself! I usually attend a Unitarian-Universalist church these days (interestingly enough, my father was raised Universalist, and converted to Catholicism in advanced age).

The pertinent part of this is that my very Catholic maternal grandmother was a card reader--ordinary playing cards (she might have appreciated Tarot if she had had access to any, but she was poor, and she grew up in the 19th century), and her generation, at least of Catholics, saw nothing wrong with this. It's like so many folk practices; it seems that those who have the least conflict between folk practices (including divination) and religion are those from Catholic peasant areas of Europe. I'm sure there are other examples. My grandmother was from la Provence de Quebec and had the kids speaking French at home even though they were almost all born here.

And even without thinking of cultures with folk practices, there is that oft-quoted dictum (and my mother quoted it often): "God helps those who help themselves." Tarot seems to have been helpful to vast numbers of people; how can that be wrong? And our talents are God-given, and we were told often that it's a sin to waste your God-given talents. So I say to the finger-pointers, so there.
 

conurelover

Hahahaha. That cracks me up then. She is also an aromatherapist and says "They are not witches, they are healers..."

This was a reply to Aeric.
 

Aeric

conurelover said:
Hahahaha. That cracks me up then. She is also an aromatherapist and says "They are not witches, they are healers..."

This was a reply to Aeric.
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That's only because she associates being a witch with something bad. Poor her. :p
 

imarya

IMHO this is a really good topic which resonates strongly within me. Thank you Holland for starting the thread. :)

I feel it's also important to express my appreciation to everyone who's participated in the thread for showing such diversity in perspective, shared with respect for the beliefs and opinions of others, and everyone's desire to learn instead of condemn.

Whether or not Tarot is "okay" for a Christian is a big thing for me. I've been going back and forth with myself about it for more than 15 years, and my deck sat in its box on my bookshelf for 6 years because I didn't want to violate my spiritual beliefs any further than I'd already done by buying, opening and touching it.

The truth of the matter is, the Bible is silent on the Tarot. While other methods of divination existed, cartomancy and the Tarot hadn't been invented at the time(s) the Bible was recorded. We are responsible for making up our own minds about it, just like we have to make up our own minds about such things as dinosaurs and the theory of evolution.

Thus, it seems to me that whether Tarot is consistent or inconsistent with a Christian's beliefs depends upon which Christian sect that individual most strongly identifies with, how that individual has interpreted the precepts of that sect, and the way in which that individual approaches Tarot.

For me, the rituals sometimes associated with the Tarot, the way the seeker phrases the question, and the reader's boundaries when approaching the cards have a lot to do with whether or not "tarot" conflicts with my Christian beliefs. I don't use the Tarot as an aid in channeling spirits, communicating with the dead, or predicting the future, because those things are all forbidden according to the religious beliefs I choose to hold.

I use the Tarot as a guide to help me look at situations from different angles when I need to "think outside the box". Doing that keeps me honest, and on track with my endeavor to be the best possible version of myself as the person God intended me to be. Sometimes Tarot is a bigger help to me than Bible verses and religion, because I was never verbally "beaten up" with the Tarot.

Life has taught me that a great many people can't tolerate the existence of another philosophy, contradictory or not. They need one "right" answer; the existence of several, equally correct alternatives is more cognitive dissonance than they can tolerate. In that environment, an opposing opinion triggers emotional meltdown.

I haven't been "confronted" about my interest in Tarot. If it should ever happen that I am [confronted], I would tell the person: in his PKT, A. E. Waite frequently references Christian concepts, symbols and the Holy Spirit. The cards he helped design (the RWS deck and its clones) include Christian symbols. The interpretations include Christian references.

I would remind the person: "occult" doesn't necessarily mean demonic, Satanic, etc. While use of the word "occult" as a noun, verb and adjective goes back centuries, the phrase "the occult" didn't appear until the early 20th century. Most definitions of occult involve knowledge that is secret, hidden, or handed down. I'd then ask the person what does the Bible say about occult practices (not "the occult")? The Old Testament prophet Daniel told us to "pray in a closet" and Christ told us to go into our rooms, close the door, and pray.

Depending upon how argumentative the person might be, I might ask how much he or she knows about "the occult" or "witchcraft" (in that setting, the terms are used interchangeably) and to explain to me the difference between homeopathic remedies and "witchcraft", or the use of altar and votive candles and "witchcraft", or the difference between icons, statuary and idols.

I might even share something I learned 15+ years ago from a friend who practices magick, which caused me to reflect upon and change the way I as a Christian pray. She said that magick is not to be used to control others; her comment made me think about--and realize--how many Christians use "prayer" as a way to try to exercise control over others, and how many "prayer requests" are actually gossip, a means of talking about someone behind his or her back, or a way to bad-mouth someone.

Since then, unless I *know* the person has requested prayer, I don't pray for that individual and don't participate in "conversations" about "prayer needs". When I do pray for another, I pray "in agreement" with that person or, if I don't know specifically what that person's request is, I pray for God's will to be manifest in that person's life.

D'ya think by then they may feel overwhelmed by the discussion and may perhaps have forgotten that they started it? :D
 

conurelover

Mentioning of idols, I had a very long discussion/argument with someone once telling me praying to Saints is the worship of an idol (I strongly disagreed because a saint isn't a God like an idol is but to each their own). I think that may be getting away from the subject. To bring it back to the subject, I don't see using Tarot/Oracles/Astrology as worshipping of an idol either.
 

foolMoon

To me, Tarot/Oracles/Astrology is just another form of messaging tool communicating with God. Nothing to do with worshiping anything.
 

conurelover

And I believe tarot/oracles help me sort out what I already subconsciously know will help me or others regarding a situation.

Dreams on the other hand...:)
 

The Happy Squirrel

LRichard said:
[...]

My background is the Reformed faith (Anglican/Episcopal and Presbyterian versions), which is different from both the Catholic and Lutheran varieties, but not so different that the germ of truth in the other versions are contradicted. It is scandalous that Christianity is so fragmented, but that's the way it goes when egos invade religion. Even the Catholics are split up into the Roman, Eastern Orthodox, Coptic, Armenian (and other flavors).
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Not that this really matters in the context of the discussions in this thread. But from what I understand, the splitting of the so called Catholic churches happened more as a result of historical evolution, than active separatism based on conflicting dogmas. So a bit more like how language, food, customs, and cultural varieties developed in the world. The differences in rites and theological interpretations is the result and not the cause of the various centres growing independently from each other for many centuries.

With the exception of one time in history when the Western Papacy were split between Rome and Avignon, more for political reasons than anything else, but I think that did not resulted in any permanent split, as the centre of power went back to Rome

Luther's and the Church of England's split from Rome on the other hand, were splits based on doctrinal differences (well, in the case of Church of England, based on political and social agenda I suppose).

:)
 
How many different tarots/oracles do you have? seventh year reading at the eagle lake pow wow 2014