Minderwiz, I'm not sure I get it since we are still at past events and I'm not sure about predictions but I took from your previous post my Lots of Marriage:
3 of the in Sagittarius
1 in Gemini
1 in Aries
1 in Libra
and I get the impression I should look at Jupiter, Mercury, Mars and Venus for possible romantic development. However, it seems a bit too much for me because chances are at least one of these planets will be in aspect to a natal related to romance/marriage, if not more. For example, Jupiter is now transiting my sixth whole house but it's my fifth in Placidus and I've felt it as fifith, so I'm not sure how much the whole house aplies... By the way, to answer your questions, the Jupiter period that started in 1998 didn't feel like 12 house at all and it was a good one, overall, there were setbacks and failures but overall it was good. Some of the happiest events in my life happened during this time. And no, I had no problem balancing career and personal life.[/quote
Yes I agree with your point about getting too many 'sensitive' points, so that one or other will be 'hit' almost continuously. It's the same issue as including more planets, asteroids, centaurs, etc/ The more you have the more likely it is that something will be 'hit'
I think that means that it will be necessary to reduce the number of 'allowable' points. Taking the ones you mentioned:
The three Sagittarius ones are:
4, 35, 39 (uses AC + Saturn - Venus day and night but no reversal for time of day
4, 35, 39 (uses AC + Saturn - Venus for day but does reverse for night.
23, 39, 16 (uses AC + Mars - Moon day and night.
The Aries one uses AC + Venus - Mars (reverses at night)
The Gemini one uses AC + Venus -Jupiter (reverses at night)
The Libra one uses AC + Moon - Sun (both day and night)
All of the use a masculine and feminine planet.
I would discount the Libra one to start with, as it will be either Fortune or Spirit, depending on whether you were born by day or night and I don't see any necessary connection here with marriage.
I'm also loathe to go with the one using Moon and Mars. Valens rationale is that Scorpio, Mars' nocutural sign is the Fall of the Moon - this is giving yourself to the point where you are taking a big risk of heartbreak. Joseph Crane sees it as Marriage as downfall. For the Marriage to be succesful the woman's Lot has to agree with her Lot of Fortune. (Which yours actually does).
That leaves the ones that use Venus. There are three pairings here, one with Saturn, one with Jupiter and one with Mars. Joseph Crane argues that the first one is a more formal, institutional version of marriage.
The Lot using Jupiter applies to both men and women and Crane argues it is more likely to be concerned with marital happiness.
The Lot using Venus and Mars, is arguably one wholly concerned with passion (though Crane argues that this would also be the case with the Libra Lot). This Lot only shows up in Firmicus. So again, I'd be tempted to put it to one side, unless that is how you feel the Lot should be.
Cranes general argument is that given the differing nature of the Lots of Marriage, we can tease out something of the nature of the relationships. The Sagittarius ones which I used, are geared to the institution of marriage and you have only had one of those relationships. You might argue that for less formal relationships one of the other Lots should be used.
Ronia said:
So... I noticed I am now in double Saturn - Capricorn and Aquarius, these are 1 and 2 house. Me and income. But it may be me and values which includes relationships. And my last romantic development happened in namely this double Saturn period and I see the end of August has been Leo (Saturn is in Leo and it was a very 8th house experience, smittening) and Virgo (not only the man is Virgo but Venus is there too and he is foreigner). I take this to mean that Saturn can also play a role which makes the whole story even more complicated. I'm currently in Cancer L3 and my natal Moon is aspected by transit by Mars, will be by Mercury and Venus but this happens every year two for Mars), again not sure how significant it could be.
I'm currently in Capricorn L4, to be replaced by Aquarius on March 10th, just a day before a New Moon in my 8/2nd house (Placidus). I'll play the lottery, juct in case.
But romantically, I don't know how to predict. May be towards the end of the month, starting from 22nd when the L4 will be Taurus...
Yes you are in a double Saturn period as far as the Lot of Fortune goes. Personally I'm not sure that ZR from Fortune should work. Unless you see marriage/relationships as something that befall you from the outside world and that your only hope of a relationship comes from hoping an opportunity comes along. I think I'd prefer to use the Lot of Marriage, which is still in a Cancer period till into next year.
That keeps us to the Sagittarius, Lots (the ones using Venus and Saturn) but if you feel one of the others is a more appropriate one for you, then try Aries or Gemini as the start point.
My feeling would be that unless you want to distinguish between possible forms of relationship - from the institutional to just the passionate, you should keep to one of the Lot definitions.
I'm sorry, I totally don't understand this. Is this about the past again? You told me once I was entering a Cancer major period in four years, is it this? I'm not sure if I understand all this "Loosing the bond" either. What exactly is called "Loosing the Bond"? Is it an event or else?
Yes I used your marriage to test ZR and my feeling is that the Lot of Marriage worked better. Assuming you are looking for another formal arrangement then you can look to future periods based on releasing from Sagittarius.
I'm not surprised by your comment on Loosing the Bond. We only have the example from Valens and he does it but doesn't explain why he does it. Now he is clearly a practicing Astrologer, rather than a compiler of past works, so we know he used it.
The procedure doesn't arise in Jupiter or Venus periods, as these last 12 and 8 periods respectively but in all the other planetary periods it basically limits the sequence to 12 periods and then switches to a new series beginning in the opposite sign.
So if you have a Moon level 4 period, it would start from Cancer, and continue through 12 signs to Gemini. Instead of starting a second round from Cancer, the sequence would shift to Capricorn. Valens uses this for Level 2, 3 and 4 periods, but says nothing about doing it for Level 1 periods but he doesn't say you can't so most modern practitioners also use if for Level 1.
As it produces a clear break in the cycle, it's argued that something significant or special should occur around that break or during the coming period. So the Loosing of the bond at Level 3 in 2005, to Cancer, contains your marriage.
On the Cancer period I mentioned previously that's a Releasing from Spirit period beginning in 5 years time. The Lot of Spirit is concerned with how we try to influence the outside world and the main way we try to do that is through our actions - a tenth place activity. This has led modern practitioners to use Releasing from Spirit to identify changes in career.
Your point about finding something somewhere that could fit any situation crops up again. It's important that you focus on one or two Lots per topic area. That is you shouldn't see a Cancer Spirit period as meaning Romance, it is more likely to mean you taking action with other people, or if you are in a relationship, you and your partner setting up in business,
As Cancer is ruled by the Moon, there's also a connotation of the general populace, so this might be a real opportunity in PR. Incidentally before you get to it, there's a Loosing of the Bond in the current Gemini L1 period on your birthday in 2015. That switches to a Sagittarius L1/L2 and as you reported a good experience of a Sagittarius period that might be a good opportunity coming your way.
On that day Jupiter is transiting your ninth house and believe it or not it's the day of your Venus return, just one minute off at the time that the new period begins. That doesn't necessarily have romantic connotations, but Venus does rule your tenth House! So it will be interesting to see what happens then.