A Most Genuine & Authentic Fake 15th Century Method!

Bernice

A few more for dissection

Hanged Man = Bad press. Public humiliation?
Pope = Intersession. Someone/Something intercedes. Agent(?)
Popess = Rules & regulations. The correct proceeedures.
Emperor = Ruling authority. Boss. (Civil Law maker?)
Justice = Relative justice (or karma). Orthodox.

B x

Melanchollic

Bernice said:
World = Heaven.
How can we use 'heaven' as a Significator (or co-sig) ?

As M.E.L., 1499 explained back in post #4,

"We shall remove trump XXI from the deck, and it shall be set aside. For since we seek to know of the mundane and most worldly of matters, the image of our Lord Triumphant or his Heavenly City are inappropriate to our task."

I guess it could be used to signify God, or eternity. You might get the question, Will I go to heaven?"

It is also great to use, along with XV, XVI, XVII, XVIII, XIIII, and XX when trying to explain Christian eschatology to Japanese people.

When telling fortunes, I usually remove XXI regardless of the method or spread in order to keep aware of and show respect to the divine. I'm weird like that!

kwaw

The world could perhaps represent any question that involves things coming to perfection or completion; saving or redeeming (mundane and temporal as well as spiritual); also new Jerusalem was often figured as a bride and in those patterns in which there is a city or a maid (as in TdM II type patterns) may thus be a siginificator in questions of 'marriage' as significator of bride, with chariot as significator of groom perhaps? (Both are in a type of chariot, the bride is encompassed by the wheels of the divine chariot). Also the four apostles went to the four corners of the world to spread the 'good news', so a significator of news perhaps, or of whether you will get your message across, or whether your commodities will sell abroad, questions of export, success of an advertising campaign, etc; also questions that may relate to one's acceptance as part of some group or another: will you be among the chosen, will I be accepted as a member of the golf club, be 'elected', the elite type thing;P Or of promotion, will I be among the risen, get a rise? Or, with the TdM II maidenl, will I be asked to the dance?

Melanchollic

kwaw said:
The world could perhaps represent any question that involves things coming to perfection or completion; saving or redeeming (mundane and temporal as well as spiritual); also new Jerusalem was often figured as a bride and in those patterns in which there is a city or a maid (as in TdM II type patterns) may thus be a siginificator in questions of 'marriage' as significator of bride, with chariot as significator of groom perhaps? (Both are in a type of chariot, the bride is encompassed by the wheels of the divine chariot). Also the four apostles went to the four corners of the world to spread the 'good news', so a significator of news perhaps, or of whether you will get your message across, or whether your commodities will sell abroad, questions of export, success of an advertising campaign, etc; also questions that may relate to one's acceptance as part of some group or another: will you be among the chosen, will I be accepted as a member of the golf club, be 'elected', the elite type thing;P

Excellent post!! Some great ideas.

Bernice

"We shall remove trump XXI from the deck, and it shall be set aside...."
Ooops. I removed the Judgment card instead! I've decided to blame next doors' cat for this. He kept looking at the cards, paw poised, eyes glinting .....

If we were to use the World (perhaps in some other approach), I do like this from kwaw;

Kwaw: The world could perhaps represent any question that involves things coming to perfection or completion; saving or redeeming (mundane and temporal as well as spiritual);

Also the Bride/Groom thoughts. Either (or their parents!) could want a reading.

Bee

eta: cross post with Mel

Melanchollic

Bernice said:
"We shall remove trump XXI from the deck, and it shall be set aside...."
Ooops. I removed the Judgment card instead! I've decided to blame next doors' cat for this. He kept looking at the cards, paw poised, eyes glinting .....

Bee

Anyone know enough about Church doctrine to say what will happen to cats on Judgement Day!? :laugh:

Rosanne

Melanchollic said:
Anyone know enough about Church doctrine to say what will happen to cats on Judgement Day!?

NO cats mentioned in the bible- not a one!
I figure that Cats do not go to heaven because there are supposedly no rats there.
Someone told me that cats are here to prove everything is not to serve man.

Bernice

.......and more;

Judgement = Legalities. A decision or act that will henceforth determine the course of the situation.
Chariot = Victory. Achievement. Public acknowledgment. (and what Kwaw said)
Death = Finality. End. Dead end

))
Devil = Chaos. Bad things. The enemy.

B. x

NO cats in heaven, it's not in the bible ?! G has a bad ghost writer!

kwaw

Rosanne said:
NO cats mentioned in the bible- not a one!
I figure that Cats do not go to heaven because there are supposedly no rats there.
Someone told me that cats are here to prove everything is not to serve man.

Well there are quite a few big cats mentioned. What about the lion of Judah, surely he has a place in heaven: and in the world to come, will not the lion lay down with the lamb, and thus by extension the dog with the cat and the cat with the mouse (and rat) ?

kwaw

Papesse - as something that is impossible in the catholic church, such a position for a woman is against the faith, then a significator of things that are denied, against accepted belief, traditions (as in the steele sermon, she that is denied by faith). As Pope Joan, as undoubtedly she would have been percieved as by some, to rise to a position by deceit, a deceiver, act of deception; tranvestites, gender bending. Also may signify the ability to rise to a position despite opposition, albeit with some degree of deception.

Signifator of things tradionally denied or marginalised by state, secular or spiritual, woman as priests, right of gays to marry, etc.

Abstract property issues, eg. copyright.

Vocation as a calling.