The World/Le Monde - Contrasting the Dodal and Conver

Parzival

The World/ Le Monde

Fulgour said:
Well said & much appreciated! Here's the thing though:
Tarot without a system is like a flag without a country.

And for me the system with Tarot is the Tarot itself...
not Hebrew Kabbalah or Astrology~I look at the cards.

What'd Shakespeare be~if you did not read the plays?
Or if you saw them performed unspoken: a dumb-show
is what they called such things back in the Bard's day.

Actually, I saw a theatre performance of Hamlet without words, only movements and gestures. It was a great proof of the power of the word. Hamlet without his speeches was a non-Hamlet Hamlet. And yet the essence of Hamlet was there, for a week , that is. Low attendence, then no attendence, alas, it was not to be. As for Tarot, the images are an analogy to Hamlet's speeches. Meant to be directly seen/heard. But there is system behind Hamlet : philosophy, history, psychology, poetry. And each Tarot has all that behind it, more or less. The direct approach, the background approach.
 

DoctorArcanus

Ross G Caldwell said:
Regarding the World as the Bride of Christ, it would be nice to find someone identifying the Soul of the World with the Bride of Christ. It seems an easy association to make.

Since this image is not attested earlier than probably 1600, we have a larger field of literature to draw upon. I personally believe the "TdM" image evolved from the earlier kinds by some such association of ideas.

Robert M. Place identifies as Anima Mundi (the Soul of the World) the Lady in the Cary Yale Visconti World card.
I never heard about "anima mundi" before reading that book and I was not much convinced. Now I think that the concept deserves more attention.

I searched the internet, and I found that the Soul of the World has been identified by some with the Holy Ghost. For instance I found this text by William of Conches (1080 - c. 1154):

Anima ergo mundi secundum quosdam spiritus sanctus est. Divina enim voluntate et bonitate (quae spiritus sanctus est, ut praediximus) omnia vivunt quae in mundo vivunt.
"The soul of the world according to some is the holy ghost. Indeed all that in the world lives lives by the will and goodness of God (and the goodness of God is the holy ghost)."
What is the Soul of the World? This is not clear to me. I understand that it is a Platonic concept that was trasferred to christina theology.

Does anybody know of images of the "Soul of the World"?

On the other hand, who is the Bride of Christ (sponsa Christi)?
I think this is a reference to the lady crowned with twelve stars that appears in the book of the Revelation.
I also found out that the the term occurs in the latin text of the consacration of the nuns ("DE BENEDICTIONE ET CONSECRATIONE VIRGINUM") :
Veni, Sponsa Christi, accipe coronam, quam tibi Dominus praeparavit in aeternum.
("Come Bride of Christ. Accept this crown that the Lord has prepared for you in ethernity")

I think that an iconography of the Bride of Christ will include some hint to marriage or to a crown, like in the Baroncelli Polyptich by Giotto.

BTW, which is the earliest known world card including the tetramorph and a central naked figure?

Marco
 

Ross G Caldwell

Hi Marco, thanks for a very rich post. I can't write much at the moment, but there is one point, seeing that you are still logged on -

DoctorArcanus said:
BTW, which is the earliest known world card including the tetramorph and a central naked figure?

I think it is the Vieville (c. 1650) or Noblet tarots. The card found in the Sforza Castle well (you can view it in the museum I believe) is of uncertain date. It could be 1650, 1700 - who knows?

This last card is shown by le pendu a few posts down.
 

jmd

This is a key point: the nakedness of the central figure in the tetramorph. Upon hundreds of churches and cathedrals are of course the Christ surrounded by the four evangelists. Usually NOT naked, however!

I personally agree with Ross Caldwell when saying that the 'image evolved from the earlier kinds by some such association of ideas'. Of these, I would suppose that those stone and painted depictions form part of the basis of the 'early kinds' of representations.

It was, perhaps, St Irenaeus of Lyons (2nd century CE) that may have been the first to link images from the four living creatures (of Revelation, harking back to Ezekiel, of course) to the four Evangelists (in Against Heresies, Book III, Ch. XI:8):
For, [as the Scripture] says, "The first living creature was like a lion," symbolizing His effectual working, His leadership, and royal power; the second [living creature] was like a calf, signifying [His] sacrificial and sacerdotal order; but "the third had, as it were, the face as of a man,"-an evident description of His advent as a human being; "the fourth was like a flying eagle," pointing out the gift of the Spirit hovering with His wings over the Church. And therefore the Gospels are in accord with these things, among which Christ Jesus is seated.​

I also nonetheless agree that by 'association of ideas', and various representations of Mary within mandorla (again, many Lumiere-style cathedrals and other religious buildings prior to the 13th century have these), it may have occurred that the figure was transformed, at first perhaps by copying 'error', to a more feminine figure that also reflected the platonic Soul of the World (as mentioned in the Timæus, section V), though very likely via the writings of Philo (perhaps more specifically his Eternity of the World) and Plotinus.

I have at times wondered, actually, whether the common title of the card as 'World' is not short-hand for a neoplatonic 'World-Soul', especially via the writings from late antiquity.

With regards to the Sforza-Castle card that le pendu posted in his post above, it is for me one of the most lovely of any depictions, and would certainly like to have a far better rendition.

When Robert (le pendu) and I were recently discussing it, Robert pointed out that the face of the Bull was chopped off. I personally suspect that this is likely a consequence of the 'border' being folded over backing, cutting off not only the face of the bull, but also the halo and wings of the Eagle and parts of the Lion's face. If indeed the image sections are 'hidden' by paper fold, it would lead further credence to our suspicion that the number 'XXI' is an addition: the early card having neither numeral nor title.

Personally, I would consider this card to be earlier than 1650. Its lack of title, its possible lack of numbering on the original, and the clarity of the image in such an early woodblock style tends to give it earlier, rather than Noblet-contemporary, dating (or so I would have thought - and that irrespective as to suggested dating by Kaplan and others).

To return to the primary images of the comparison, one item of interest is the alteration or difference between the Dodal's usage of leaves to cover the genitals, to what is effectively a more 'naked' depiction on the Conver, using the fold of cloth to mask the genitals from the viewer's perspective.

A seeming transition from an Adamic depiction in Dodal (Jesus as second Adam?) to a cloth (equivalent to a loin cloth?) of post-resurrected Christ.

Of course, in this, whence, how, and why the specific transition from masculine-like to feminine-like figure?
 

DoctorArcanus

jmd said:
This is a key point: the nakedness of the central figure in the tetramorph. Upon hundreds of churches and cathedrals are of course the Christ surrounded by the four evangelists. Usually NOT naked, however!

Since the text of the Revelation is of particular relevance to this discussion, I quote it here:

St. John - Book of the Revelation said:
4:2 And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.

4:3 And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone: and there was a rainbow round about the throne, in sight like unto an emerald.

4:4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.

4:5 And out of the throne proceeded lightnings and thunderings and voices: and there were seven lamps of fire burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirits of God.

4:6 And before the throne there was a sea of glass like unto crystal: and in the midst of the throne, and round about the throne, were four beasts full of eyes before and behind.

4:7 And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle.

4:8 And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, Holy, holy, holy, LORD God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come.

The rainbow quoted in the Revalation is the "mandorla" that appears as an oval wreath in the World cards we are examining.

Still this revelation passage points out one more difference: the figure in the Revelation is sitting on a throne, not standing (and indeed the the Pantocrator Christ is usually represented in a rainbow "mandorla" sitting on a throne).
A good example of this can be seen in the article by Eguchi Koretaka on association.tarotstudies.org. In this X Century ivory, Christ is sitting on a throne, with his feet on what seems to me a globe representing the world.

jmd said:
I have at times wondered, actually, whether the common title of the card as 'World' is not short-hand for a neoplatonic 'World-Soul', especially via the writings from late antiquity.

I think that, before the TdM pattern appeared (XVII Century?), almost all World cards represented a sphere of some kind (with the exception of Cary-Yale Visconti). I think that for those World cards (e.g. Visconti-Sforza or Grigonneur) the name World is quite fitting.

jmd said:
With regards to the Sforza-Castle card that le pendu posted in his post above, it is for me one of the most lovely of any depictions, and would certainly like to have a far better rendition.

I agree: the technical quality of the Sforza-Castle card is quite superior to Noblet and Vieville. What can better be compared are the face and feet of the naked figure (since they are not damaged in the Sforza-Castle card): the feet display a correct perspective, that is absolutely missing from the other two cards!

jmd said:
When Robert (le pendu) and I were recently discussing it, Robert pointed out that the face of the Bull was chopped off. I personally suspect that this is likely a consequence of the 'border' being folded over backing, cutting off not only the face of the bull, but also the halo and wings of the Eagle and parts of the Lion's face. If indeed the image sections are 'hidden' by paper fold, it would lead further credence to our suspicion that the number 'XXI' is an addition: the early card having neither numeral nor title.

I think Robert is right. On Kaplan II pg. 293 there are a few of the Sforza-Castle cards. In the six of coins, it is quite clear that the back of the card has a dotted pattern, and where the dotted patter is not present making visible the front engraving, we can see that the front engraving has a black border. On the other hand, the face of the bull in the World card is cut by a black border that I think is the border of the engraving of the front of the card.

jmd said:
To return to the primary images of the comparison, one item of interest is the alteration or difference between the Dodal's usage of leaves to cover the genitals, to what is effectively a more 'naked' depiction on the Conver, using the fold of cloth to mask the genitals from the viewer's perspective.
A seeming transition from an Adamic depiction in Dodal (Jesus as second Adam?) to a cloth (equivalent to a loin cloth?) of post-resurrected Christ.
Of course, in this, whence, how, and why the specific transition from masculine-like to feminine-like figure?

The resurrected Christ sounds very likely to me. Instead of the dressed Christ sitting on a throne of the Revelation we have a naked standing figure.
A standing (almost) naked Christ can indeed be seen in images of the resurrection, such as Matthias Grünewald's masterpiece.

The Irenaus text is excellent. Not only the association with the Evangelist was an early one, but the four symbols were also loaded with more moral/theological meanings. Wonderful!
In the ivory described by Eguchi Koretaka at least three of the four virtues appear together with the tetramorph. I wonder if there also was an early connection between the symbols of the Evangelists and the Cardinal Virtues....

These cards really are a World of their own :)

Marco
 

DoctorArcanus

Homo Microcosmus

This image from Minerva Britanna (1612) could provide one more possible explanation for the naked figure we see in the world card.

Since I had a few problem with the poem associated with the image, I post it here with some words replaced:


Hear what's the reason why a man we call
A little world and what the wiser meant
By this new name: two lights Celestial
Are in his head, as in the Element.
Just as the wearied Sun at night is spent,
So seems but the life of man a day,
At morn he's born, at night he flies away.

Of heat and cold as is the Air composed,
So likewise man we see breath's wet and cold,
His body's earthy: in his lungs enclosed,
Remains the Air: his brain does moisture hold,
His heart and liver, to the heat enfold:
Of Earth, Fire, Water, Man thus framed is,
Of Elements the threefold Qualities.

Could the symbols of the Evangelists signify the four Elements?
I think the World card of the traditional Tarocchino from Bologna represents a circle divided in four quarters, each representing one of the four elements.

Marco
 

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jmd

Ah! That Isenheim altarpiece! A truly magnificent set of imagery, with even some of the more horrid scenes so life-filled as well this one.

For anyone living near Colmar (in France near the Swiss and German border), it is an important spiritual image, even if it has been moved to a room more secular touristic than spiritual in intent.

I would normally agree that a typical exegesis of the four living creatures connects it to the four elements via their astrological correlations (to the four fixed signs of the zodiac), and that prior to the times in which these cards were created.

Astrological-astronomical-theological maps of the times and earlier also clearly show the various spheres surrounding the earth with the other three elements, and then the seven planetary spheres, followed by of course the eighth immovable stellar one, and the various spiritual hierarchies.

Where this remains distinct is in the sense that the 'spiritual' is within the representations of the four elements - if we make the correlations. Here is, of course, one possible exegesis that could be made (and that I have also posted elsewhere on Aeclectic): the four living creatures become linked to the four fixed signs of the zodiac and to the tetragrammaton, within which is the Fire of the Holy Spirit (having in some way a feminine characteristic), the whole giving Yeshuah (or, rather, YHSVH).

A few aspects of this that become interesting is that the four fixed signs of the zodiac, in their 'natural' position, occupy the 2nd, 5th, 8th, and 11th position, adding to 26, the value of YHVH. With the added Shin within (21st letter for XXIst card), the name becomes transformed to not only that of Christ, but also links it to the Tongues of Fire of the Holy Spirit of the second baptism, and further provides a link between the World Soul and the Holy Spirit within the imagery itself - something I wanted to pick up in some small manner after DoctorArcanus's mention of the connection in William of Conches's 12th century text.

This does, however, take it to beyond the cards as given... in such an interesting manner.
 

roppo

We see a strange, or rather bizarre imagery of Four Evangelical Beasts and the Trinitiy in the Thielman Kerver Book of Hours (Paris, 1506).

http://www7.ocn.ne.jp/~elfindog/kvrtrin.jpg

My wild guess is that some of Le Monde cards might be a composite of several elements, for example, the Virgin and the Holy Ghost etc.
 

DoctorArcanus

Thanks to Roppo for the beautiful image and to everybody for the interesting discussion! :)

jmd said:
This does, however, take it to beyond the cards as given... in such an interesting manner.

Yes, I cannot help going off-topic ;)
I tried to transfer some of our ideas on http://www.tarotpedia.com/wiki/index.php/World
If you want to have a look and correct, edit, add of course you are welcome!
I know a lot of the interesting things/hints posted here are missing from tarotpedia and would deserve further study....

Marco
 

DoctorArcanus

In Christ there is neither male nor female

Ross G Caldwell said:
Some commentators have claimed there are Christs with breasts around; I have yet to see them, but I would certainly like to. If they were in a Victory wreath, like the World card, it would be even better.

Yesterday, while reading an essay by Maurizio Calvesi about Caravaggio, I found an interesting reference to John Scottus Eriugena (IX Century CE). On the internet, this page about Johannes Scottus seems to be quite good.
Here is the concept quoted by Calvesi, as expressed in the web article:


Eriugena adopts Gregory of Nyssa's view that sexual difference is a result of the Fall, that the real Fall is the fall from intellect into sense, intellect distracted by the voluptuousness of sense. So, sexual difference really makes no difference for humans, or as Eriugena boldly puts it: ‘Man is better than sex’ (homo melior est quam sexus, II. 534a). This, Eriugena believes, agrees with Scripture: ‘in Christ there is neither male nor female’ (IV.795a).

Calvesi was writing about The supper at Emmaus a 1600 ca painting which represents an (almost) "androgynous" Christ.

Marco