ncefafn
I keep hearing that this deck has a political agenda, but no one ever says what it is. What is it???
Kim
Kim
Cranky and ranting: the Wheel of Change Tarot
Astraea
Personally, I am not discrediting the deck -- I like it! My sense is that Firemaiden does, too, though I wouldn't presume to speak for her. It's the book that is disappointing. My own view of its political agenda revolves around an approach to feminism, spirituality and ritual that is so cliched that it almost seems cynical. But the artwork is lively and buoyant.
firemaiden
Lets see - just about all the PC agendas you can think of ... not that I disagree with any of these agendas by the way, they are all perfectly wonderful campaign slogans, I just don't like politics interfering in a reading...
-save the earth
-save the goddess
-save the homeless
-save the redwoods
-save the poor downtrodden naked and noble primitives of the earth... (multicultural perspectives, depictions of all the different peoples of the earth in primitive costumes-- nice idea but it just feels very patronizing somehow -- to them)
-and of course, it's totally feminist.
-save the earth
-save the goddess
-save the homeless
-save the redwoods
-save the poor downtrodden naked and noble primitives of the earth... (multicultural perspectives, depictions of all the different peoples of the earth in primitive costumes-- nice idea but it just feels very patronizing somehow -- to them)
-and of course, it's totally feminist.
ncefafn
Thanks, Firemaiden. I kinda suspected that's what was going on, but wasn't sure. It does make me wonder if there ever has been or ever will be a conservative, Rush Limbaugh-kinda Tarot:
Burn the forests
Kill the little deer and bunny rabbits
Save the white man
Get a job!
Kim
Burn the forests
Kill the little deer and bunny rabbits
Save the white man
Get a job!
Kim
Cerulean
Ah, a divine spark...
Sometimes the irritation is a tack on a chair, sometimes it's a divine spark. It sounds like you were attracted as I was to the quiltsy folk-art feel that might have made this a 'comfort deck'.
But maybe it would be a motherly or aunt-like comfort deck that isn't necessarily fiery enough to elicit the divine spark of your talented storytelling tastes.
I traded or gave this deck/book set away and settled on looking for other theme decks...may I suggest two that might appeal to your interest in color and a different storylike take on the majors and minors?
I think your other posts seemed to draw comfort from edgy or interesting art decks, such as Secrets and Trevisan' (Elisabetta and Giorgio's different decks) or if you don't mind the unclad, various cards from Giacinto Gaudenzi's from Lo Scarabeo. The renamed Hidden Folk (used to be titled Enchanted or Golden Dawn, but was renamed three times to not confuse it with other decks) and has it's share of colorful multicultural babies and goblins, sometimes it's hard to tell the difference...by the way, the backs of the Hidden Folk deck is gorgeous.
Sometimes you can put a deck away for awhile and it works. But after a year, two even, the Wheel of Change didn't do it for me. I sometimes play with the Hidden Folk, but decided instead that the funky Kazanlar I gave/traded for shipping costs is better for me.
I have two suggested alternates for you: I think both the colorful Kazanlar and Hidden Folk use the Marseilles ordering, although the Hidden Folk is more Thothlike if I remember cards such as Justice being depicted..
Hidden Folk:
http://www.learntarot.com/ecdesc.htm
Hidden Folk with ugly Justice:
http://www.trigono.com/tarots/TP001-dolden-dawn-tarot-deck.htm
Justice in the Hidden Folk is NOT my favorite, but she's true to a Thoth description of having an ostrich feather and being on tiptoes and holding a scale...it's supposed to be a humorous slant, my guess, same as the "Book of Rael" suggestion mirrors the "Book of Thoth".
Kazanlar:
http://www.spiritone.com/~filipas/Masquerade/Reviews/kazanlar.html
Hope these suggestions help you decide what to do with your troublesome Wheel of Change...
Cerulean Mari
Sometimes the irritation is a tack on a chair, sometimes it's a divine spark. It sounds like you were attracted as I was to the quiltsy folk-art feel that might have made this a 'comfort deck'.
But maybe it would be a motherly or aunt-like comfort deck that isn't necessarily fiery enough to elicit the divine spark of your talented storytelling tastes.
I traded or gave this deck/book set away and settled on looking for other theme decks...may I suggest two that might appeal to your interest in color and a different storylike take on the majors and minors?
I think your other posts seemed to draw comfort from edgy or interesting art decks, such as Secrets and Trevisan' (Elisabetta and Giorgio's different decks) or if you don't mind the unclad, various cards from Giacinto Gaudenzi's from Lo Scarabeo. The renamed Hidden Folk (used to be titled Enchanted or Golden Dawn, but was renamed three times to not confuse it with other decks) and has it's share of colorful multicultural babies and goblins, sometimes it's hard to tell the difference...by the way, the backs of the Hidden Folk deck is gorgeous.
Sometimes you can put a deck away for awhile and it works. But after a year, two even, the Wheel of Change didn't do it for me. I sometimes play with the Hidden Folk, but decided instead that the funky Kazanlar I gave/traded for shipping costs is better for me.
I have two suggested alternates for you: I think both the colorful Kazanlar and Hidden Folk use the Marseilles ordering, although the Hidden Folk is more Thothlike if I remember cards such as Justice being depicted..
Hidden Folk:
http://www.learntarot.com/ecdesc.htm
Hidden Folk with ugly Justice:
http://www.trigono.com/tarots/TP001-dolden-dawn-tarot-deck.htm
Justice in the Hidden Folk is NOT my favorite, but she's true to a Thoth description of having an ostrich feather and being on tiptoes and holding a scale...it's supposed to be a humorous slant, my guess, same as the "Book of Rael" suggestion mirrors the "Book of Thoth".
Kazanlar:
http://www.spiritone.com/~filipas/Masquerade/Reviews/kazanlar.html
Hope these suggestions help you decide what to do with your troublesome Wheel of Change...
Cerulean Mari
Shade
So would the shadow work approach to this be to find out what this irritation with the deck says about your own inner "stuff". I don't want to presume that every irritation is somehow a shadow trait representing something we ought to work on/heal (I hate that) and I am not a huge devotee of Jung.... however sometimes it has helped me to look at what bugs me from that perspective. In some cases the thing no longer bugs me because I've gotten past some "stuff" I wasn't even aware of.
I liked the deck but then I liked Starhawk's books especially Spiral Dance and Dreaming the Dark so i'm drawn to the ecofeminist perspectove... but like all perspectives it aint for everyone.
I liked the deck but then I liked Starhawk's books especially Spiral Dance and Dreaming the Dark so i'm drawn to the ecofeminist perspectove... but like all perspectives it aint for everyone.
SongDeva
I think Shade has a point Firemaiden. Do a spread on how you are supposed to work with this deck, what it will teach you or bring to light for you.
That said, I just got it (go bargain girl!) and I really really like it. I esp. like temperance, which is not usually a card that stands out for me. Liked the empress too (she looks like me!).
I don't get anything patronizing, and I don't pick up on an agenda. For me, it's an artist's portrayal. I have also not opened the book. Which gets me to wondering, why do I buy the sets, even when some sell the deck separately? Must be for trade value, cause I never read the dang things. Unless, I find a five of wands in a reading and it makes NO sense, then the book will usually have the answer I need right at that moment.
Anyway, back to you - I don't pick up on this stuff, but you do. If you can stomach it long enough, it might be worth it to find out why!
Love and Light,
Sd
That said, I just got it (go bargain girl!) and I really really like it. I esp. like temperance, which is not usually a card that stands out for me. Liked the empress too (she looks like me!).
I don't get anything patronizing, and I don't pick up on an agenda. For me, it's an artist's portrayal. I have also not opened the book. Which gets me to wondering, why do I buy the sets, even when some sell the deck separately? Must be for trade value, cause I never read the dang things. Unless, I find a five of wands in a reading and it makes NO sense, then the book will usually have the answer I need right at that moment.
Anyway, back to you - I don't pick up on this stuff, but you do. If you can stomach it long enough, it might be worth it to find out why!
Love and Light,
Sd
firemaiden
You all say some very helpful things. SongDeva: I'd love to hear more from you about how you get along with the deck. (and how you interpret the five of wands)
You know, there are things I love about it. The Star is really beautiful. I like the nine of wands with the dijeridoos and kangaroos. -- I think Astraea is right -- it is more the book than the deck that irks me. Astraea, you may indeed speak for me. You say things so incredibly well!
Cerulean, you make an interesting observation, that I draw "comfort" from "edgy" decks -- LOL. (How can this be??) I took a look at the Kanzalar, it is really beautiful!! As for the Hidden Folk, or, as I call it -the Mermaid-as-Termperance Deck) -- this was one of my first decks. I like the majors a lot. I like that it is based on the Thoth - but the minors are seriously lame) -- I'd like to trade it in for the 22 art card version
ncefafn - - a deck that says "save the white man" (hilarious!!) or how bout "save the dead white man."
Perhaps I'd be less irritated if I weren't born, bred, educated, and marinated in the multi-culturalist-eco-feminist perspective - having come from Genetti's neck of the woods.
Maybe if I push through this, I'll end up adoring it. Some things in life that nauseated me at first, later became consuming passions. I hated the French language when I first heard it, and I hated opera. (LOL)
You know, there are things I love about it. The Star is really beautiful. I like the nine of wands with the dijeridoos and kangaroos.
-- I think Astraea is right -- it is more the book than the deck that irks me. Astraea, you may indeed speak for me. You say things so incredibly well!Cerulean, you make an interesting observation, that I draw "comfort" from "edgy" decks -- LOL. (How can this be??) I took a look at the Kanzalar, it is really beautiful!! As for the Hidden Folk, or, as I call it -the Mermaid-as-Termperance Deck) -- this was one of my first decks. I like the majors a lot. I like that it is based on the Thoth - but the minors are seriously lame) -- I'd like to trade it in for the 22 art card version
ncefafn - - a deck that says "save the white man" (hilarious!!) or how bout "save the dead white man."
Perhaps I'd be less irritated if I weren't born, bred, educated, and marinated in the multi-culturalist-eco-feminist perspective - having come from Genetti's neck of the woods.
Maybe if I push through this, I'll end up adoring it. Some things in life that nauseated me at first, later became consuming passions. I hated the French language when I first heard it, and I hated opera. (LOL)
lark
I think this is the only deck I have ever bought on the basis of one card.
The 10 of Swords.
It just smacked me in the head when I first saw it.
It speaks so loudly to how I feel about gardening, one of my big hobbies.
How the control of nature takes over and through the winter we just wait.
Our gardening tools are in suspended animation, things left right where we dropped them in the fall.
Actually useless untill spring comes again.
What a fresh new way to see the 10 of Swords.
I have never read the book either.
There are some cards I don't understand...
Like the 5 of Wands...
The 9 of Disks
The 9 of Swords
And some that I think are brilliant.
Like the 2 of Swords.
A scissors and a paper snowflake.
Says to me that what I chose to cut out of my life, the decisions I make will determine the beauty of my snowflake.
And the little paper heart cut in half at the bottom: that some of those decisions will be painful.
I think after reading this I won't look in the book.
It sounds like it comes with too much baggage.
And this all brings up a very interesting question.
To read or not to read?
When an author makes up their own non traditional meanings for the cards are we better off working with the cards for a time bookless....
Or do we miss out on the authors symbolism?
I've done both and in this case I'm glad I didn't read the book.
Once you do it ruins the innocence of seeing the cards in a fresh way.
I think maybe that is what is bugging you about this deck firemaiden.
It could have been a great imagination deck for you but it's spoiled now because you have the authors agenda in your head.
I don't know how you would get it out of there short of a lobotamy...
And then I think you'ld lose some other real useful stuff along with it.
So that wouldn't be my first choice.
You might just have to trade it and start fresh.
Much cheaper than a lobotomy and more practical.
The 10 of Swords.
It just smacked me in the head when I first saw it.
It speaks so loudly to how I feel about gardening, one of my big hobbies.
How the control of nature takes over and through the winter we just wait.
Our gardening tools are in suspended animation, things left right where we dropped them in the fall.
Actually useless untill spring comes again.
What a fresh new way to see the 10 of Swords.
I have never read the book either.
There are some cards I don't understand...
Like the 5 of Wands...
The 9 of Disks
The 9 of Swords
And some that I think are brilliant.
Like the 2 of Swords.
A scissors and a paper snowflake.
Says to me that what I chose to cut out of my life, the decisions I make will determine the beauty of my snowflake.
And the little paper heart cut in half at the bottom: that some of those decisions will be painful.
I think after reading this I won't look in the book.
It sounds like it comes with too much baggage.
And this all brings up a very interesting question.
To read or not to read?
When an author makes up their own non traditional meanings for the cards are we better off working with the cards for a time bookless....
Or do we miss out on the authors symbolism?
I've done both and in this case I'm glad I didn't read the book.
Once you do it ruins the innocence of seeing the cards in a fresh way.
I think maybe that is what is bugging you about this deck firemaiden.
It could have been a great imagination deck for you but it's spoiled now because you have the authors agenda in your head.
I don't know how you would get it out of there short of a lobotamy...
And then I think you'ld lose some other real useful stuff along with it.
So that wouldn't be my first choice.
You might just have to trade it and start fresh.
Much cheaper than a lobotomy and more practical.
Chronata
I had to make sure that this was in fact the deck I had...but now after lark's desciptions I am sure that it is!
I like a lot of images in this deck...and I was intrigued with working with it, but I consider it my sad little handicapped deck!
For one thing, I didn't exactly lob the book...but I promptly lost it after a day of owning it! Don't for the life of me know where the heck the book went...but it got swallowed up by my parent's house...
And then when I first opened it...fresh from the factory... I noticed it was missing about four cards! That's quite a lot! Almost too many to write to the publisher about, (although it nicely included not one, not two...but THREE Death cards!!)
Even though I really like a lot of the images...I am not all that sure ...given a full working deck...that I would ever have actually used it. Like Firemaiden...I absolutely love the colors...and the sorta modern take on some cards is very insightful.
It's funny...because I lost the book, I wasn't even aware of the deck's politics! The fact that mine is a "few cards short of a full deck" makes me think it fits in nicely with author's agenda! (Save the handi-capable!)
Maybe I need to take another look at this funky little deck...
I like a lot of images in this deck...and I was intrigued with working with it, but I consider it my sad little handicapped deck!
For one thing, I didn't exactly lob the book...but I promptly lost it after a day of owning it! Don't for the life of me know where the heck the book went...but it got swallowed up by my parent's house...
And then when I first opened it...fresh from the factory... I noticed it was missing about four cards! That's quite a lot! Almost too many to write to the publisher about, (although it nicely included not one, not two...but THREE Death cards!!)
Even though I really like a lot of the images...I am not all that sure ...given a full working deck...that I would ever have actually used it. Like Firemaiden...I absolutely love the colors...and the sorta modern take on some cards is very insightful.
It's funny...because I lost the book, I wasn't even aware of the deck's politics! The fact that mine is a "few cards short of a full deck" makes me think it fits in nicely with author's agenda! (Save the handi-capable!)
Maybe I need to take another look at this funky little deck...
