"Intuition" versus "book learned"

[Apocalipstick]

OTOH, I've known readers who ask up front if people only want to hear the good stuff and not the bad stuff.

Really? Huh. I have learned something new today.

But then, I haven't been to that many readers. To be askied that, though, might make me consider the reader will try to make things pretty anyway.

Now that would be more consistent with my experience of having a reading done for me. I realize this is a _small_ unrepresentative sample, but all three times I've had a professional reading done, the reader kept on taking about my inner bliss.

With two of them I had the feeling they had had uncomfortable experiences with previous querents. I guess I'd call this an impression obtained intuitively, except I stand by my original take that intuition is a form of knowledge.

For example: the body language one of the readers employed when turning over the 10 of swords clued me in to the fact she'd try to step around the card. Which she did, even if a more "negative" interpretation would have been more appropriate to the situation as presented in the spread. It wasn't so much an unexplained insight into the situation, as an analytical assessment based on previous experiences with, in this instance, body language.

It's learning to trust the knowledge obtained in moments like that that's the tricky part. And probably the reason why intuition seems so mysterious.

 

[Grizabella]

Assuming your first statement is refering to what I said.

OK, if I read a certain card and the querent interrupts and says "No no, that card is supposed to mean x, not y", well, I'm sorry but again, they're paying me to do the reading. of course again if they see something in the cards that makes sense to them that's one thing, but to argue because they think I should interpret it according to what they say is the book meaning?...no...that'd be like me going to a doctor and saying "I'm sorry but I think you're totally wrong."

I do tell my doctor that I think he's wrong if or when I think so. It's my body, after all, and I expect to have a good degree of say-so on what happens to it. They're just human, like I am, and although I defer to their greater knowledge in some things, I'm not afraid to speak up if I think something isn't right. That might come from being married into a family of doctors and working in a medical field myself, but if you have a client who challenges a meaning, I presume they'd be somewhat knowledgable about tarot, too.

I don't think it's arrogant. Of course I wouldn't put it to them that harshly, and of course we're providing a service and should work with them. It's a fine line I guess

I don't see a fine line.

But I wear glasses, sooooooo------

 

[euripides]

If I'm trying to figure out who this court card is and the querent goes, "oh, no that's probably my sister, we're having an argument..." of course I'm going to listen, unless I have a very strong reason to feel otherwise.

 

[gregory]

I have only ever received on-line readings in forums.

I had one in the intuitive circle here once; I know people here know their stuff and do their best. But it made no sense at all. And I mean NONE. I just thought - oh well. and SO ? these things happen. You cannot be right all the time.

Two weeks later......................... There was a total change in something which I could not POSSIBLY have seen coming, even with gentle guidance, suggestions of things I might have missed, etc (you know the sort of thing - a tree falls on your house, uncovering a chest of gold coins under its roots and you suddenly become rich!!!) and when that kicked in, the reading made perfect sense after all.

Now I wonder - if I had been face to face with the reader, whether I might have argued and disagreed. And forced something else out of it and not been ready to use what I then - after the change - had available to me from the reading I had dismissed.

 

[gregory]

Then again, I'm often accused of being anti-intuitive. To a certain extent, I suppose I am, because I never know what people mean when they say they read intuitively. Throwing out the symbolism? If so, why use cards?

That's not meant as a flame, btw, just something that's always been a mystery to me.

Hello, flamer....

No but really..... thanks for this post.

I was drawn into reading through the "intuitive" circles here and for a while I said I read intuitively. But because of definition issues, I don't say that any more. I just say I read. But when you ask about throwing out the symbolism - I don't specifically do that; I guess I just use it differently. I look at the image on the card and what I can actually SEE in the card, and read from that. If there is a boot and a shoe - I might wonder about why this could be in the specific situation I am reading about, for instance, rather than what the Penguin Dictionary says such a configuration means (there are a few cheap copies on Abe at the moment, by the way - I just got one !)

 

[Grizabella]

I have only ever received on-line readings in forums.

I had one in the intuitive circle here once; I know people here know their stuff and do their best. But it made no sense at all. And I mean NONE. I just thought - oh well. and SO ? these things happen. You cannot be right all the time.

Two weeks later......................... There was a total change in something which I could not POSSIBLY have seen coming, even with gentle guidance, suggestions of things I might have missed, etc (you know the sort of thing - a tree falls on your house, uncovering a chest of gold coins under its roots and you suddenly become rich!!!) and when that kicked in, the reading made perfect sense after all.

Now I wonder - if I had been face to face with the reader, whether I might have argued and disagreed. And forced something else out of it and not been ready to use what I then - after the change - had available to me from the reading I had dismissed.

But even if you had disagreed with it, you'd still have heard what the reader had to say and you'd still have had the actual experience that happened in two weeks to prove the reader right. You did dismiss it, in effect, in the sense that it made no sense and you shrugged it off. So how would disputing the reader have made any difference?

 

[Keigh]

But sometimes a certain image or feeling comes to mind that is triggered by the card that might have little to do with the usual meanings... usually I'll say something like "well usually this card means such-and-such, but I feel this about it ..." so I might go back to that, esp here where people are familiar with the cards, that way they don't think I'm off in la-la land.

That's exactly what happens to me - I may offer the traditional information, but will also say that an image, story, or whatever, keeps coming into my mind and I feel it may have relevance...then I share it. It's amazing how often that is the "key" to the whole thing. In the beginning, I was afraid to say those things, but saw them play out later and I wondered why I kept silent. I would read for friends or family and hold in something that "didn't fit the book" but was echoing inside my head. Later, the events in the life of the person I was reading for would reflect that echo. I never really felt like saying..."oh, yeah, I saw that coming....but didn't say anything to you" Who'd have believed it. I did take note of it though and have begun to share these "flashes" that come my way. They aren't always played out for me to see, so I don't know if they're always right or only sometimes right....but I think it pays to share.

 

[gregory]

But even if you had disagreed with it, you'd still have heard what the reader had to say and you'd still have had the actual experience that happened in two weeks to prove the reader right. You did dismiss it, in effect, in the sense that it made no sense and you shrugged it off. So how would disputing the reader have made any difference?

It wouldn't have made a difference in one sense - except that if I had argued with the reader and they had in any way backed down and tried to go along with me. I may then have lost the benefit of sort of saving it for later, if you see what I mean. And it must be really hard for a face to face reader (I have never done it, I realise this !) to have a really strong feeling about something (as no doubt my reader did) and have the querent right in front of them just say they're wrong and feel; that they "ought" perhaps to change tack - to "please the client" as someone said further up.

I'm trying to look at this from the point of view of how the reader might have felt if I'd done that, as well as what I might have lost by pushing them another way and then accepting THAT version, and discarding the other. By shelving it I had the chance to say "oops, she was right" later. I probably wouldn't have done that if I'd already "changed" the reading to suit what I knew at the time. Don't you think most clients take what they get at the time rather than coming back to it all later ? I'd be surprised if many do revisit readings rather than going for a new one ? (I admit I don't know....)

 

[Apocalipstick]

Don't you think most clients take what they get at the time rather than coming back to it all later ? I'd be surprised if many do revisit readings rather than going for a new one ? (I admit I don't know....)

I can't answer for myself here, but for a while I was friends with a woman who was constantly going to Tarot readers, psychics, clairvoyants--whatever she could find.

She'd always talk about her amazing experiences, but I couldn't really see her really paying attention to any of the stuff she said she was told. Well, except for the parts where she was surrounded by positive energy fields.

However, I'm pretty sure she's not the norm.

With the professional readings I had, I did try to think about them, but my memory for these things is shoddy, and I have a hard time accepting the predictive aspect. For me, this is more about personal growth than divination.

The only reading I remember fairly well was the positive-spin only one, which would have been on the money if the reader wouldn't have tried to make things pretty.

 

[Umbrae]

What the hell is intuition anyways...stupid word.

Gregory's right. Sometimes, a sitter wants you to 'back down.'

I was doing a reading on Thursday night, the woman had gone through some painful events...and her question was about 'spiritual centering', on how to get grounded...

And the cards started talking about her job. And more job stuff. And even more job stuff. What was going on at work and more...

She wanted me to change subjects, wanted me to talk about something different. But in good conscious - I was not able to do so.

She had difficulty with the reading.

She also brought notes from her last reading (different reader), and had told me the final card of that reading. So when we were finished, I slid the top card off the deck, and put the deck back in my pouch. She said, “What’s that?"

"That’s a wrap-up card, kinda encapsulates everything we’ve been talking about." This is something I never do - but the little voice in the back of my head told me to...so...I listened.

She turned it over. It matched the final card of her previous reading.

She kinda freaked.

There are skills you learn from reading live, that books cannot teach. Mentoring will help, but you will never have these experiences if you never read live, or if you only read books about Tarot.

If folks want to argue, or if they are a ‘reader’ testing you – how you act, requires a communication skill set that is gleaned from hours of communicating with others. Ain’t no way ‘round that one (IMO).